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westslope

westslope Avatar

Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Jun 20, 2019 - 9:50am



 kurtster wrote:

.....
I also still believe that Trump is the anti war POTUS.  He's fighting wars with money (sanctions and tariffs), not bullets.  .....
 
Are you delusional?  

He just supported the Israeli annexation of Jerusalem and appears poised to support the Israeli annexation of the Golan Heights.  He appears ready to continue supporting the Israeli settlers in Occupied West Bank .

Strikes me that the USA continues to support taking land and resources by violent force.  

kurtster, Have you ever killed somebody in order to steal from them?   Just curious.  
Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 20, 2019 - 9:45am



 Red_Dragon wrote:
So, in announcing his 2020 campaign, he goes after Hillary Clinton. A person who is utterly irrelevant at this point. What. The. Actual. Fuck.
 
If I were Hillary, I'd be really worried about her chances in 2020.

Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 20, 2019 - 9:44am



 Red_Dragon wrote:
"Nobody's ever been treated badly like me."
 

Lincoln was shot. Kennedy, too. Reagan. 
But Trump has been treated the worst.
westslope

westslope Avatar

Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Jun 20, 2019 - 9:41am



 kurtster wrote:
So we have two, not one, oil tankers on fire in the Strait of Hormuz after being hit with mines.  And the week before, two other tankers had holes blown in their hulls.  And oil prices are basically down, not up.  I got gas for $2.26 a couple of days ago and have seen it even lower since.  Normally prices would have skyrocketed and maybe some missiles or something would have gone off by now.

Nope. 

The world is definitely a different place now.

Thanks Donnie !!!
 

Yes.  Thankfully Donnie is sabotaging global economic growth and is helping to keep oil prices down despite all production outages and threats to supply.

Thankfully, the USA boasts the lowest excise taxes on gasoline and diesel among all the rich OECD club members.  

Thankfully the USA boasts 37% plus obesity rates and high rates of COPD because elsewhere these would be viewed negatively but in the good ol' USA high rates of obesity and COPD are viewed as incredible accomplishments!  
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: drifting
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 7:26pm

 kcar wrote:

Help me out here, since I've lost track/interest in the rat warren of the theories about conspiracies against Trump: the FBI had started investigating Trump's connections and contacts with Russians two months before Steele's reports reached the Bureau on Sept.  19, 2016.  IIRC the FBI has proven that the Steele Dossier was not the basis for the start of its investigations into Trump-Russia connections. And Steele has consistently stated that the material he gathered was "raw intelligence"—reports and rumors that had not been fact-checked or verified. Furthermore, a conservative Washington paper, the Washington Free Beacon, commissioned Fusion GPS to begin investigating the Trump connection during the GOP primaries; the Clinton campaign hired Fusion GPS only after the Free Beacon stopped its investigation into Trump about the time that Trump received the GOP nomination. 

So the FBI had started its own investigation into Trump before Fusion GPS hired Steele to look into Trump-Russia ties.

Fusion GPS was already investigating Trump as opposition research for GOP politicians (the second link notes that the Free Beacon is funded by a major Marco Rubio donor) before HRC got involved. And Steele never presented his material as verified facts, only rumors and reports that might serve as starting points for careful investigations. 

Where is your conspiracy? Don't you think it's possible that Trump and his allies are doing their best to discredit the FBI as being involved in a conspiracy (or "coup" as you like to put it)? Frankly, I see a sleazy liar desperately trying to fight against the facts. Dick Nixon made the same claims of conspiracies against him back during the Watergate scandal. 

 
Prior to working for Fusion GPS, Steele was a paid FBI informant for several years.  He was fired for leaking to the media.  The back door that Steele worked to the DOJ after he was fired from the FBI was through Bruce Ohr and his wife Nellie, an employee of Fusion GPS. 

It Started With a Lie: Bruce Ohr's Linchpin Role in Collusion Narrative

Fusion GPS didn’t just get Bruce Ohr’s valuable attention, the firm used it to make an ask. Nellie Ohr acknowledged in her own congressional interview what Fusion GPS had in mind when Steele invited her and her husband to breakfast at the Mayflower Hotel on July 30, 2016. “Chris Steele was hoping that Bruce would put in a word with the FBI to follow up on the information in some way.” He did just that.

Why, if Ohr was willing to tell the FBI about his conflict of interest, had he done his best to hide it on his annual ethics filing? Why didn't he correct his filing to make it consistent with what he was telling the bureau? Perhaps because he counted on the FBI to keep his role in the affair secret. Ohr encouraged the FBI to listen to Steele’s stories. When Steele broke the bureau’s rules and lost his privileged (and paid) status, Ohr stepped in to keep the stories flowing. He would talk to Christopher Steele and then report the conversation to an FBI handler who would write up the discussion in a classified form 302.
.
This whole thing reeks so bad.  Matters to me, maybe no one else ...

Oh and not that anyone has mentioned obstruction of justice lately, but ...

Judicial Watch: Nellie Ohr Deleted Emails Exchanged with DOJ Husband Bruce Ohr


Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 6:55pm

His supporters are the finest people...
kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 1:46pm

 kurtster wrote:

No.  She paid for the dossier that contained that information gathered directly from Russian sources.

 
Help me out here, since I've lost track/interest in the rat warren of the theories about conspiracies against Trump: the FBI had started investigating Trump's connections and contacts with Russians two months before Steele's reports reached the Bureau on Sept.  19, 2016.  IIRC the FBI has proven that the Steele Dossier was not the basis for the start of its investigations into Trump-Russia connections. And Steele has consistently stated that the material he gathered was "raw intelligence"—reports and rumors that had not been fact-checked or verified. Furthermore, a conservative Washington paper, the Washington Free Beacon, commissioned Fusion GPS to begin investigating the Trump connection during the GOP primaries; the Clinton campaign hired Fusion GPS only after the Free Beacon stopped its investigation into Trump about the time that Trump received the GOP nomination. 
So the FBI had started its own investigation into Trump before Fusion GPS hired Steele to look into Trump-Russia ties. Fusion GPS was already investigating Trump as opposition research for GOP politicians (the second link notes that the Free Beacon is funded by a major Marco Rubio donor) before HRC got involved. And Steele never presented his material as verified facts, only rumors and reports that might serve as starting points for careful investigations. 

Where is your conspiracy? Don't you think it's possible that Trump and his allies are doing their best to discredit the FBI as being involved in a conspiracy (or "coup" as you like to put it)? Frankly, I see a sleazy liar desperately trying to fight against the facts. Dick Nixon made the same claims of conspiracies against him back during the Watergate scandal. 
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 10:30am

The Evangelical, the ‘Pool Boy,’ the Comedian and Michael Cohen
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: A sunset in the desert
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 8:31am



 Red_Dragon wrote:
 

congrats, another promise kept!
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 8:23am

 Red_Dragon wrote:
 
Not at all swampy either...

Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 6:56am

Hope Hicks Questioned on Episodes of Potential Obstruction by Trump
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 6:53am

Thanks, Donnie!
Proclivities

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Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 6:22am



 kurtster wrote:

Relevant if you still believe the Moscow Golden Showers really happened.  Many still do.
 
Do many of the people he was speaking to believe that?  If not, she is irrelevant to his announcement and merely being brought up as another misdirection/whataboutism tactic - going back to his "greatest hits" from the 2016 campaign while vilifying someone who is not a candidate.  He will soon start railing about John McCain again no doubt.  He did promise that if re-elected cancer and AIDS would be cured though, which is interesting since he proposes cutting HHS funding by more than 10% .

kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: drifting
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 19, 2019 - 4:44am

 kcar wrote:


What, did Hillary pee on Trump? I'd pay good money to see that. 
 
No.  She paid for the dossier that contained that information gathered directly from Russian sources.


kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: Jun 18, 2019 - 9:29pm

 kurtster wrote:

Relevant if you still believe the Moscow Golden Showers really happened.  Many still do.

 

What, did Hillary pee on Trump? I'd pay good money to see that. 

gif of Trump jumping up and down in puddle of pee

kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: drifting
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 18, 2019 - 8:01pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:
So, in announcing his 2020 campaign, he goes after Hillary Clinton. A person who is utterly irrelevant at this point. What. The. Actual. Fuck.

 
Relevant if you still believe the Moscow Golden Showers really happened.  Many still do.
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 18, 2019 - 7:01pm

So, in announcing his 2020 campaign, he goes after Hillary Clinton. A person who is utterly irrelevant at this point. What. The. Actual. Fuck.


miamizsun

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Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 18, 2019 - 5:58am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:
hmm,  couple of thoughts:

I think we can all agree that the ideal is to have a free flow and complete transparency of information. In this ideal situation, everyone can say what they want and everyone can refute what they want. In this case the actions of a foreign power pales into significance, relativized by all the other noise out there.

However, the situation changes when you don't have a free market of ideas, when various institutions have a monopoly on the tools used to disseminate and communicate information. Also if you do not have a population that has learned the basic tools of critical thinking, you also run the risk of undue influence being exerted by shady forces/government manipulation etc.
(this can also be on the part of the domestic government, not just foreign governments). Just look at the power/influence of various religious organizations throughout history. It deteriorates rapidly when the truth is hidden, when political agendas are not disclosed and people purport to be something they are not.

Of course the best defense against all of this is having a free population composed of individuals who have learnt the basics of critical thinking and who are heathy and wealthy enough not to have their votes bought. It also necessitates freedom of the press and security from being persecuted on grounds of faith or political alignment. Unfortunately, these are hardly given truths. We are lucky enough to live in countries we they seem natural. But they are anything but.
 

i'm in a bit of a hurry, but i wanted to add this:

speaking of critical thought, or applying the scientific method/methodology to social action science (or human action science)

here are some lectures pointed in that direction and are for the most part brilliant and life changing (i consider them treasures)

context? they are about 25 years old (i have lectures of him and his mentors going back to the seventies)

probably the some most thought provoking stuff i've ever consumed

i also believe it is critical to start with the first lecture and go through them in order (and only move on after a decent understanding of each)

obviously undisciplined and or anxious folks looking for immediate gratification will skip around

more serious science minded peeps (all three of them {#Wink} ) will probably pay attention and listen in order

good luck and enjoy!

R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jun 17, 2019 - 4:11pm

 kurtster wrote:
I also still believe that Trump is the anti war POTUS.  He's fighting wars with money (sanctions and tariffs), not bullets.

You mean "bombs and other munitions" don't count?

 kurtster wrote:
People can say what they want; Trump has a knack of getting people to reveal more about themselves than they ever planned.

Certainly true for his most ardent supporters...
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 17, 2019 - 4:02pm

"A president can run the country. And that's what happened, George. I run the country, and I run it well."
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