I can only speak for myself on this one. I give a rat's ass about what this country is and what it means. My family arrived in Maine in 1640, 136 years before the revolution. Is that long enough to say my family is from America and not somewhere else ? I'm not angry with the illegals per se, except for their bitching and complaining about how they are treated. Trespassers bitching, really ? Who I am angry with are those who let them in. Those who refuse to enforce the laws and protect our borders.
You may come in through the front door, but eff those who break in through the side window. Come here for what we already are, not to change us. We do not need people who think that anyplace is better than where they are presently. Find another place. Its as simple as that.
I can understand your point of view, I think. I don't think the illegal immigrants themselves are complaining about this issue as much as the American citizens who feel threatened job-wise are.
This issue shouldn't have turned into a major one. We should have looked at federal policy during prosperous times, when immigration was peaking, and updated it. I told my parents years ago that people wouldn't complain about illegal immigrants until the economy went south.
I think that there should be a path to citizenship for those already here and contributing to society. As far as I can tell, most of the illegal immigrants here want to assimilate into American society and aren't keen to hive off into a re-creation of their past worlds. The notion that shariah law is spreading through the Midwest is hysterically goofy.
It'd be nice if Trump offered some real ideas about illegal immigration but he just wants to bluster like some drunk at the bar about The Wall. BlueHeronDruid wrote:
Change can be good but ultimately is inevitable. Every legal immigrant, every coming-of-age citizen, is poised to bring change.
True. America has gone through waves, large and small, of immigration. The social and cultural fabric of this country is constantly changing and we've regularly gone through periods of anti-immigrant sentiment. Signs reading "Irish need not apply" seem quaint now, but they were deadly serious in their time.
You may come in through the front door, but eff those who break in through the side window. Come here for what we already are, not to change us. We do not need people who think that anyplace is better than where they are presently. Find another place. Its as simple as that.
It's not that simple. It really isn't.
We live in a gated community. (For the record, gate is open 6a to 6p weekdays, closed weekends.) It's not what we were looking for, but what we fell in love with, and what we could afford. The gate doesn't do much for me (as you know, I have some fierce-sounding dogs) though I appreciate the element it keeps off our private beach. Yes, I've seen drug deals go down there. Yes, I've encountered someone smoking meth. It happens. Our beach is a private and attractive nuisance, and getting in the gate is as easy as drafting the car in front of you.
But as the demographics change here (younger people moving in, raising children, as opposed to the founding "vacation home" retirees) so do the HOA R&Rs. I think that someday we'll be allowed to have chickens. Discreet fences around the food we would like to grow for ourselves and not the black-tailed deer.
Change can be good but ultimately is inevitable. Every legal immigrant, every coming-of-age citizen, is poised to bring change. We can either embrace it and shepherd it, or fear it and try to kill it. I vote the former. It isn't always happiness and light. But it is the way of the world. Find me a place where that hasn't happened.
Frankly, I don't think most Trump supporters give a toss about culture. They want their jobs and economic future back. Their anger at illegal immigrants and China and trade is based on perceived threats to their jobs.
I can only speak for myself on this one. I give a rat's ass about what this country is and what it means. My family arrived in Maine in 1640, 136 years before the revolution. Is that long enough to say my family is from America and not somewhere else ? I'm not angry with the illegals per se, except for their bitching and complaining about how they are treated. Trespassers bitching, really ? Who I am angry with are those who let them in. Those who refuse to enforce the laws and protect our borders.
You may come in through the front door, but eff those who break in through the side window. Come here for what we already are, not to change us. We do not need people who think that anyplace is better than where they are presently. Am I supposed to believe that those who get here illegally care about those who are here already ? Really ? Find another place. Its as simple as that.
Ugh. Rumor has it he's coming to our Big Sky state...shall I paint a protest sign? Should it stick up for Immigrants? Woman? Physically disabled? Blacks? Mexicans? Muslims? Big Sky for Big Signs!
Ugh. Rumor has it he's coming to our Big Sky state...shall I paint a protest sign? Should it stick up for Immigrants? Woman? Physically disabled? Blacks? Mexicans? Muslims? Big Sky for Big Signs!
What do we know in regards to either Hillary or Bernie on these matters ? Just as little, maybe even less. So many say that it really doesn't matter who is POTUS, they will all do the same thing because they can't change anything regardless of what they claim.
Me, I'm voting for this ...
Loved the Addams Family clip. You like train wrecks? You'll get a bunch of them with Trump. Republicans love to call Carter the worst President and say he was unprepared. Trump has no policies. He has no idea how completely unprepared he is.
The man's ego has gotten away from him. I see his speeches and I see an older version of Charlie Sheen during his manic phase.
kurtster wrote:
And, I'd like to know what's in Hillary's transcripts from her speeches to Goldman Sachs, etal.
Trump has said he will release his taxes after his audit is done. We'll never see Hillary's transcripts.
I'd like to see Hillary's transcripts as well. But if there were bombshell statements—equivalent to Romney's 47% remark— in them, people in the audience for those speeches would have the press let know a long time ago.
I doubt you'll see Trump's returns. rotekz wrote:
Getting hung up on particular policies not being fleshed out at this moment is missing the big picture.
Politics is downstream of culture. Cultural decline has put the West in real danger of internal collapse and takeover.
There are three main forces currently at war: globalist socialism, Islam and nationalism. Only one will prevail over the next century. If it is not nationalism, we and particularly our descendants are screwed.
Trump understands this and is the only person that can save America and beyond that, Western civilization.
I don't give a crap about the big picture. The big picture isn't going to keep Americans from sliding into poverty or help them afford college and health care.
Trump wants to be President. How is he going to address the problems we have today? He hasn't said because he doesn't know.
Trump is bluffing.
Frankly, I don't think most Trump supporters give a toss about culture. They want their jobs and economic future back. Their anger at illegal immigrants and China and trade is based on perceived threats to their jobs.
Rotekz, the West has been declining and falling for centuries. It'll be around long after you and I are gone.
"Trump understands this and is the only person that can save America and beyond that, Western civilization."
Who knew that the Son of God would look so ridiculous, puffy and old during his Second Coming.
I'm sorry, I can no longer take you seriously. I doubt there's anything that anyone can say to keep you from swilling the Kool-Aid.
Ya know, its reached the point where we know a lot more about this batch of candidates than in recent memory. There is very little we don't know at this point. And those who are not informed will never be, they'll just show up and vote D and R like they always do and that is that. And as usual, the least informed is the majority of voters.
and so it goes.
Quite an about face there. In the previous post there was little we knew, but even less so about the others.
Now there is very little we don't know. So I guess you'd be able to answer the original questions that led to your original answer...
But maybe you won't, because that would be giving away the strategy.
It's the nuance of rhetoric. It's consistent with that in mind.
Ya know, its reached the point where we know a lot more about this batch of candidates than in recent memory. There is very little we don't know at this point. And those who are not informed will never be, they'll just show up and vote D and R like they always do and that is that. And as usual, the least informed is the majority of voters.
Ya know, its reached the point where we know a lot more about this batch of candidates than in recent memory. There is very little we don't know at this point. And those who are not informed will never be, they'll just show up and vote D and R like they always do and that is that. And as usual, the least informed is the majority of voters.
and so it goes.
Quite an about face there. In the previous post there was little we knew, but even less so about the others.
Now there is very little we don't know. So I guess you'd be able to answer the original questions that led to your original answer...
But maybe you won't, because that would be giving away the strategy.
I know when I'm being lectured to condescendingly, my friend. And I don't have nearly as dismissive an attitude towards my fellow voters as you seem to.
Carry on.
You're looking for things that aren't there.
The post you reference wasn't even directed to you in the first place.
Edit: I see. Because even though you are also dismissive of your fellow voters, you can be personally offended because your are less dismissive than I am of the same people.
I'm speaking in terms of the general public. I consider most all who participate here pretty well informed. Maybe not correctly, but at least paying attention or trying to.
Why don'tcha try reading it again with that thought in mind.
I know when I'm being lectured to condescendingly, my friend. And I don't have nearly as dismissive an attitude towards my fellow voters as you seem to.
I'm speaking in terms of the general public. I consider most all who participate here pretty well informed. Maybe not correctly, but at least paying attention or trying to.
Why don'tcha try reading it again with that thought in mind.
The only ones in the US who we could call truly well-informed right now are Bernie supporters. His underlying message is that the 1% have bought and rigged almost the entire political and government system to benefit themselves. George
Carlin got exactly what Bernie is now all about 15 yrs ago.
1 - probably true, but the world has left isolationism behind, and nationalism, well, that usually doesn't end up well. 2 - irrelevant 3 - unsubstantiated 4 - both are really establishment; how does Trump skate by on being anti-establishment when he is its essence? 5 - opinion 6 - irrelevant. Criticism of political correctness is code for "I want to insult minorities, disadvantaged, and disabled." 7 - that's from biology, not politics 8 - tax policy is set by Congress. 9 - doesn't Trump want to bomb the out of ISIS? That's not a good avoidance strategy. 10 - would you not want to incentivise "losers" (whatever the hell that is) so that they are no longer "losers?" (whatever the hell that is)
The only substantive comparisons you have here are 1 and 9.
Don't try to confuse him with facts, his mind is made up. Trump is The Messiah.
1. Globalism vs nationalism 2. Militant feminism vs masculinity 3. More job losses vs job creation 4. Establishment vs anti-establishment 5. Nepotism/cronyism vs meritocracy 6. Political correctness vs political incorrectness 7. Illegal invasion and subversion of host culture vs preserving the host culture 8. Very high taxes for earners vs low taxes for earners 9. Stupid wars vs avoiding stupid wars 10. Incentivizing losers vs incentivizing winners
1 - probably true, but the world has left isolationism behind, and nationalism, well, that usually doesn't end up well. 2 - irrelevant 3 - unsubstantiated 4 - both are really establishment; how does Trump skate by on being anti-establishment when he is its essence? 5 - opinion 6 - irrelevant. Criticism of political correctness is code for "I want to insult minorities, disadvantaged, and disabled." 7 - that's from biology, not politics 8 - tax policy is set by Congress. 9 - doesn't Trump want to bomb the <*> out of ISIS? That's not a good avoidance strategy. 10 - would you not want to incentivise "losers" (whatever the hell that is) so that they are no longer "losers?" (whatever the hell that is)
The only substantive comparisons you have here are 1 and 9.
It's truly a shame we're not as well informed as you.
"Unjustified certainty is the bane of understanding and the death of effective reasoning."
Tim Urban
You always try and find the low road, don'tcha ?
I'm speaking in terms of the general public. I consider most all who participate here pretty well informed. Maybe not correctly, but at least paying attention or trying to.
Why don'tcha try reading it again with that thought in mind.
Ya know, its reached the point where we know a lot more about this batch of candidates than in recent memory. There is very little we don't know at this point. And those who are not informed will never be, they'll just show up and vote D and R like they always do and that is that. And as usual, the least informed is the majority of voters.
and so it goes.
It's truly a shame we're not as well informed as you.
"Unjustified certainty is the bane of understanding and the death of effective reasoning."
Ya know, its reached the point where we know a lot more about this batch of candidates than in recent memory. There is very little we don't know at this point. And those who are not informed will never be, they'll just show up and vote D and R like they always do and that is that. And as usual, the least informed is the majority of voters.
and so it goes.
Except usually less than half show up to vote at all except in Ore and Wash which are 100% vote by mail,........ which is why Republicans hate vote by mail so much. At least the D's are well informed enough to not vote against their own best interests, unlike the "well-informed" Republican middle class.
