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Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » WikiLeaks Page: 1, 2, 3 ... 54, 55, 56  Next
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R_P

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Posted: Mar 2, 2024 - 11:53am

"America's Biotch"

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Posted: Feb 21, 2024 - 10:43am


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Posted: Feb 20, 2024 - 6:52am

Chris Hedges: Julian Assange’s Final Appeal

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Posted: Dec 24, 2023 - 12:09pm


haresfur

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Posted: May 6, 2023 - 4:00pm

 Lazy8 wrote:

Making source documents available without editorial intervention was what made the information credible. Wikileaks doesn't spin, doesn't shield anyone from the consequences of what the documents reveal. Withholding information to help or hinder a particular political candidate would have wrecked Wikileaks' credibility. It hurt Hillary? Fine. To paraphrase Kant, if the truth would kill them, then let them die.

And they don't just reveal US secrets. They have data-dumped documents from everywhere.


So you are saying there is no legitimate reason for governments to keep anything private. I disagree with that. People have and will continue to die because of government leaks. It would be much easier to build or improve nuclear weapons because of government leaks. There is a legitimate purpose for open discussions within government that could be cherry-picked by other journalists to further an agenda if leaked. Happens all the time. 

They also specifically worked to hurt Hillary's campaign. That goes against what you are saying about them being a neutral party.
Lazy8

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Posted: May 5, 2023 - 8:57pm

 haresfur wrote:
 My main trouble with Assange is that he just dumped everything into public space with no journalistic or ethical consideration that releases of some things have consequences that can't be justified. I have no trouble with Snowdon but Assange was not acting as a journalist or with any patriotic (in a broad sense of the word) intent.

I also don't have much any sympathy because he really screwed himself by not facing up to the Swedish rape charges (whether or not they were true). He didn't want to go to Sweden, supposedly because he didn't want to be extradited to the US (I doubt that is true). So he holes up in the Ecuadorian embassy for longer than he likely would have been incarcerated if found guilty of the rape charges. Turns out the Obama administration wouldn't have charged him but he helped Trump win and now faces extradition from Britain. What an utter idiot.

Making source documents available without editorial intervention was what made the information credible. Wikileaks doesn't spin, doesn't shield anyone from the consequences of what the documents reveal. Withholding information to help or hinder a particular political candidate would have wrecked Wikileaks' credibility. It hurt Hillary? Fine. To paraphrase Kant, if the truth would kill them, then let them die.

And they don't just reveal US secrets. They have data-dumped documents from everywhere.
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Posted: May 5, 2023 - 8:18pm

A Kingly Proposal: Letter from Julian Assange to King Charles III
haresfur

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Posted: Sep 9, 2020 - 4:39pm



 R_P wrote:
Julian Assange is not on trial for his personality – but here’s how the US government made you focus on it
Assange is not on trial for skateboarding in the Ecuadorian embassy, for tweeting, for calling Hillary Clinton a war hawk, or for having an unkempt beard as he was dragged into detention by British police. Assange faces extradition to the United States because he published incontrovertible proof of war crimes and abuses in Iraq and Afghanistan, embarrassing the most powerful nation on Earth. Assange published hard evidence of “the ways in which the first world exploits the third”, according to whistleblower Chelsea Manning, the source of that evidence. Assange is on trial for his journalism, for his principles, not his personality.

 
My main trouble with Assange is that he just dumped everything into public space with no journalistic or ethical consideration that releases of some things have consequences that can't be justified. I have no trouble with Snowdon but Assange was not acting as a journalist or with any patriotic (in a broad sense of the word) intent.

I also don't have much any sympathy because he really screwed himself by not facing up to the Swedish rape charges (whether or not they were true). He didn't want to go to Sweden, supposedly because he didn't want to be extradited to the US (I doubt that is true). So he holes up in the Ecuadorian embassy for longer than he likely would have been incarcerated if found guilty of the rape charges. Turns out the Obama administration wouldn't have charged him but he helped Trump win and now faces extradition from Britain. What an utter idiot.

R_P

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Posted: Sep 9, 2020 - 3:00pm

Julian Assange is not on trial for his personality – but here’s how the US government made you focus on it
Assange is not on trial for skateboarding in the Ecuadorian embassy, for tweeting, for calling Hillary Clinton a war hawk, or for having an unkempt beard as he was dragged into detention by British police. Assange faces extradition to the United States because he published incontrovertible proof of war crimes and abuses in Iraq and Afghanistan, embarrassing the most powerful nation on Earth. Assange published hard evidence of “the ways in which the first world exploits the third”, according to whistleblower Chelsea Manning, the source of that evidence. Assange is on trial for his journalism, for his principles, not his personality.

Steely_D

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Posted: Apr 26, 2020 - 1:34pm



 kurtster wrote:
In case you missed this earlier this evening ...

.
 
 

I thought there was agreement that we shouldn't be listening to celebrities/musicians/artists? Is that not a thing any more?

and poor Tucker. He always looks like he's a combination of confused and constipated.
kurtster

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Posted: Mar 6, 2020 - 10:01pm

In case you missed this earlier this evening ...

.
 
R_P

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Posted: Feb 26, 2020 - 2:07pm

 jahgirl8 wrote:
You seem too cheerful and active...

Aww, someone has a theory of mind. How very special.
jahgirl8

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Posted: Feb 26, 2020 - 1:46pm

You seem too cheerful and active after such a disaster debate.  Assange ain't no thang.

 R_P wrote:
 


R_P

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Posted: Feb 26, 2020 - 1:35pm

Your Man in the Public Gallery – Assange Hearing Day 2
A last small incident for me to recount: having queued again from the early hours, I was at the final queue before the entrance to the public gallery, when the name was called out of Kristin Hrnafsson, editor of Wikileaks, with whom I was talking at the time. Kristin identified himself, and was told by the court official he was barred from the public gallery.

Now I was with Kristin throughout the entire proceedings the previous day, and he had done absolutely nothing amiss – he is rather a quiet gentleman. When he was called for, it was by name and by job description – they were specifically banning the editor of Wikileaks from the trial. Kristin asked why and was told it was a decision of the Court.

At this stage John Shipton, Julian’s father, announced that in this case the family members would all leave too, and they did so, walking out of the building. They and others then started tweeting the news of the family walkout. This appeared to cause some consternation among court officials, and fifteen minutes later Kristin was re-admitted. We still have no idea what lay behind this. Later in the day journalists were being briefed by officials it was simply over queue-jumping, but that seems improbable as he was removed by staff who called him by name and title, rather than had spotted him as a queue-jumper.

None of the above goes to the official matter of the case. All of the above tells you more about the draconian nature of the political show-trial which is taking place than does the charade being enacted in the body of the court. There were moments today when I got drawn in to the court process and achieved the suspension of disbelief you might do in theatre, and began thinking “Wow, this case is going well for Assange”. Then an event such as those recounted above kicks in, a coldness grips your heart, and you recall there is no jury here to be convinced. I simply do not believe that anything said or proved in the courtroom can have an impact on the final verdict of this court.

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Posted: Feb 19, 2020 - 11:55am

Donald Trump 'offered Julian Assange a pardon if he denied Russia link to hack'
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Posted: Jun 10, 2019 - 4:54pm

U.S. delivers formal extradition request for Julian Assange to U.K.
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Posted: Jun 1, 2019 - 11:46am

The Unrelenting State
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Posted: May 23, 2019 - 1:42pm

Assange Indicted Under Espionage Act, Raising First Amendment Issues
kcar

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Posted: Apr 12, 2019 - 9:02pm

 haresfur wrote:

I meant the statute of limitations on the US charges. He should have taken his chances on Sweden.  The Swedes could really mess with the Americans by trying to get him extradited there

 
Oh, I think that the Swedes will try to get him extradited there, and my guess is that they'll succeed. The Swedes likely will have first crack at Assange because they filed first. 
As for the US govt. indicting Assange right before the statute of limitations ran out...{#Think}   (sadly, no shrug emoticon available). My guess is that the Justice Dept. wanted to keep the option of trying him on the table. Maybe they knew the Ecuadorean government was going to throw him out of the Embassy and thought they'd get in line to prosecute him, just in case. 

But wow are you right about Assange being a dick and making bad choices. Someone—Wikileaks denies involvement—leaked photos of a luxurious lifestyle from the phones of  Ecuadorean president Moreno in an attempt to embarrass and blackmail him. Moreno turned the matter into a plus for himself and shortly thereafter had Assange turned out. 

Wikileaks according to the NYT piece had threatened Ecuador earlier. On October 14 2016, an aide to SoS John Kerry and a woman who'd worked in the Clinton White House visited the Ecuadorean ambassador during a black-tie dinner at the ambassador's residence. At that time, Wikileaks had just started releasing John Podesta's emails to the public. The day after that meeting, Assange's Internet access was curtailed. But Wikileaks threatened Ecuador and the Internet service was restored. 
WikiLeaks struck back soon after. On Oct. 16, the day after Mr. Assange’s internet was restricted, WikiLeaks tweeted a code, known in its parlance as an “insurance file,” and signaled that an upcoming leak involving Ecuador was imminent.

Mr. Assange certainly seemed to have acquired compromising material. In 2015, Cynthia Viteri, a prominent Ecuadorean politician, and Fernando Villavicencio, an Ecuadorean political journalist, had gotten secret documents showing that Ecuador was running a surveillance program, using an Italian company to spy on journalists and political enemies, in addition to spying on Mr. Assange at the embassy.

Mr. Villavicencio said he sent the material to a WikiLeaks email address, hoping the organization would publish the information. He eventually published the documents himself. WikiLeaks never did, though it is clear from leaked 2015 chat group logs from WikiLeaks Forum, a related site, that Mr. Assange and his inner circle were aware of them.

Mr. Villavicencio said he believed the documents he sent to WikiLeaks may have been among those that Mr. Assange had threatened to publish.

Nothing ever came of the Ecuador-related “insurance file” WikiLeaks tweeted about in October 2016.

“From 2011, WikiLeaks did not leak relevant information regarding Correa’s government,” Mr. Villavicencio said. “That certainly shows hypocrisy and a double standard, contradicting journalism principles.”

...


But Ecuadorean officials contend that the expulsion comes from an extensive list of transgressions by Mr. Assange that soured their long — and often strained — relationship.

In explaining his decision, Mr. Moreno accused Mr. Assange of installing electronic distortion equipment in the embassy, blocking security cameras, confronting and mistreating guards and gaining access to security files without permission.

...


Fernando Cutz, a former senior adviser to H.R. McMaster, the former national security adviser, and a Latin America policy specialist at the White House, acknowledged that American officials regularly spoke with their Ecuadorean counterparts about handing over Mr. Assange.

But Mr. Cutz argued that Ecuadorean officials did not simply cave to American demands. They wanted Mr. Assange gone as well, he said.

“We would definitely raise it with Ecuador,” Mr. Cutz said. “It was a bilateral irritant, without a doubt. But I don’t think the U.S. pressure ended up being the reason for this move. Bettering relations with the U.S. was just the icing on the cake for Moreno. Assange was his own worst enemy.”


haresfur

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Posted: Apr 12, 2019 - 3:55pm



 kcar wrote:

This WaPo piece doesn't give me the impression that the statute of limitations on the rape charge he faced in Sweden was about to run out. 

Two women accused Assange of acting in a nonconsensual manner after they separately had consensual sex with him in Sweden. Assange returned to the UK after being with the women but eventually faced extradition back to Sweden due to "allegations of sexual molestation, unlawful coercion and rape."


In June 2012, with his legal avenues exhausted, Assange finally faced extradition to Sweden. Instead, he fled to the Ecuadoran Embassy. Eight weeks later, he was granted asylum. Assange would not leave the embassy until this week.


...


Time ran out to pursue the Swedish allegations of molestation and unlawful coercion in 2015. Prosecutors decided to discontinue the rape investigation against Assange in 2017, with (Swedish prosecutor Marianne) Ny saying at a news conference in Stockholm that “all possibilities to advance the investigation have now been exhausted.”


This week may change that. On Thursday, chief prosecutor Ingrid Isgren said that Sweden had not been informed ahead of time that Assange would be expelled from the embassy. Deputy Director of Public Prosecution Eva-Marie Persson noted that the statute of limitations for the rape case would not run out until 2020.

“We will now examine the case in order to determine how to proceed,” Persson said in a statement.

Ove Bring, a professor of international law at the University of Stockholm, said that if Sweden revived the case, that would imply a new European arrest warrant, a mechanism of the European Union, that would require Britain to extradite Assange.


Another WashPo article explains the nature of charges that the US government has brought against Assange: 

With Assange’s arrest, U.S. and British authorities ended a seven-year saga in which the anti-secrecy crusader stayed just beyond their reach while his group dumped classified and politically volatile materials onto the Internet. U.S. prosecutors confirmed for the first time that they had secretly charged Assange last year with conspiring with an Army intelligence analyst to illegally obtain secret U.S. military and diplomatic documents, which Assange’s group published online. He is accused of helping Chelsea Manning, the former soldier then known as Bradley Manning, perhaps unsuccessfully, try to crack a government password.

It could be some time, though, before he answers to that charge in an American court. Analysts say Assange’s extradition could take years, and only after he is in the United States can he begin what is expected to be a vigorous defense, arguing that he is like any newspaper publisher and that the charge against him is unjust.

...



Ecuador, which took in Assange when he faced a Swedish rape investigation in 2012, said it was rescinding asylum because of his “discourteous and aggressive behavior,” and for violating its terms.

Personally, I think it would be very difficult for Assange to defeat a charge of trying to illegally obtain secret US government documents if he did help Manning try to crack a password. Receiving and publishing classified documents, such as the Pentagon Papers, is one thing. Actively trying to steal or illegally obtain those secured documents is another. 


 

I meant the statute of limitations on the US charges. He should have taken his chances on Sweden.  The Swedes could really mess with the Americans by trying to get him extradited there
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