Kurt, you might have had a point, but then went off to Mars with Carter comments. Carter was referring to a specific group of radical demonstrators, not any political opponent of Obama.
"When a radical fringe element of demonstrators and others begin to attack the president of the United States as an animal or as a reincarnation of Adolf Hitler or when they wave signs in the air that said we should have buried Obama with Kennedy, those kinds of things are beyond the bounds," the Democrat who served from 1977-1981 told students at Emory University.
"I think people who are guilty of that kind of personal attack against Obama have been influenced to a major degree by a belief that he should not be president because he happens to be African American.
"It's a racist attitude, and my hope is and my expectation is that in the future both Democratic leaders and Republican leaders will take the initiative in condemning that kind of unprecedented attack on the president of the United States," Carter said.
I was going to put this with my post but decided not to. But glad I did not close the window. I can find more such by Carter. It is not the only time he has said this.
So you expect everyone to accept your denials at face value regarding hating Obama, yet are unwilling to extend the same courtesy regarding people who dislike Trump's policies.
See a double standard here?
No, because few have ever believed me. It has been going on for me here for 10 years. Just treating him as I have been treated.
I do not believe you. Because of the way you condemn his supporters the same as you condemn him.
Most here have accused me of hating Obama since day one, which I have steadfastly denied. I hate no one.
So you expect everyone to accept your denials at face value regarding hating Obama, yet are unwilling to extend the same courtesy regarding people who dislike Trump's policies.
I do not believe you. Because of the way you condemn his supporters the same as you condemn him.
Most here have accused me of hating Obama since day one, which I have steadfastly denied. I hate no one. I had problems with his policies and tried to stick to just that. But the accusations of racism, xenophobia, fill in the blank continue to this day. The left has been pounding its opposition incessantly ever since Jimmy Carter came out on a Today Show interview and stated that the biggest reason anyone would disagree with Obama on anything was because they were racist. And it has continued for the following 8 years. And now we are still the same type of person if we support Trump.
And people still wonder why anyone supports Trump. The democratic party has made it perfectly clear that they wish people like me would just die and go away. They don't even want to try and win us over. We are not worthy of the air we breathe. That is the message sent. Big tent my ass. Inclusion my ass. And now we hate children, too.
Those who blame Trump for all the polarizing have long forgotten Carter's words that set this current round into motion, 10 years ago. Trump is what you get after someone like Obama. Obama did nothing to calms things done, just further exploit Carter's pronouncement and play martyr and sore winner.
And just because, the democrats just really floored me yesterday when they gave Agent Strzok a huge ovation, wished him hugs, kisses and even a Purple Heart for his bravery during his testimony, ignoring all the things said in his texts, because they agree with Strzok and see him as their hero and cultural warrior. And I Strzok mentioned here earlier without any disagreement with the things he said, just how it was understandable given the circumstances. I let this sit for a long time before hitting submit. Yep, I mean every word of it.
Kurt, you might have had a point, but then went off to Mars with Carter comments. Carter was referring to a specific group of radical demonstrators, not any political opponent of Obama.
"When a radical fringe element of demonstrators and others begin to attack the president of the United States as an animal or as a reincarnation of Adolf Hitler or when they wave signs in the air that said we should have buried Obama with Kennedy, those kinds of things are beyond the bounds," the Democrat who served from 1977-1981 told students at Emory University.
"I think people who are guilty of that kind of personal attack against Obama have been influenced to a major degree by a belief that he should not be president because he happens to be African American.
"It's a racist attitude, and my hope is and my expectation is that in the future both Democratic leaders and Republican leaders will take the initiative in condemning that kind of unprecedented attack on the president of the United States," Carter said.
Speaking for myself - and probably many others as well - I don't want him to fail, I simply understand that he was a failure before he came to the office and that he continues to be one.
Also in my case; hatred is incorrect. Profound disgust and aversion, yes; but not hatred.
I do not believe you. Because of the way you condemn his supporters the same as you condemn him.
Most here have accused me of hating Obama since day one, which I have steadfastly denied. I hate no one. I had problems with his policies and tried to stick to just that. But the accusations of racism, xenophobia, fill in the blank continue to this day. The left has been pounding its opposition incessantly ever since Jimmy Carter came out on a Today Show interview and stated that the biggest reason anyone would disagree with Obama on anything was because they were racist. And it has continued for the following 8 years. And now we are still the same type of person if we support Trump.
And people still wonder why anyone supports Trump. The democratic party has made it perfectly clear that they wish people like me would just die and go away. They don't even want to try and win us over. We are not worthy of the air we breathe. That is the message sent. Big tent my ass. Inclusion my ass. And now we hate children, too.
Those who blame Trump for all the polarizing have long forgotten Carter's words that set this current round into motion, 10 years ago. Trump is what you get after someone like Obama. Obama did nothing to calms things done, just further exploit Carter's pronouncement and play martyr and sore winner.
And just because, the democrats just really floored me yesterday when they gave Agent Strzok a huge ovation, wished him hugs, kisses and even a Purple Heart for his bravery during his testimony, ignoring all the things said in his texts, because they agree with Strzok and see him as their hero and cultural warrior. And I Strzok mentioned here earlier without any disagreement with the things he said, just how it was understandable given the circumstances. I let this sit for a long time before hitting submit. Yep, I mean every word of it.
So Trump is obviously regarded by many as a bad president, and by many a bad person. But is the hatred going too far...so far as if we want him to fail, rather than succeed? Is that thinking good for the country? Shouldn't we encourage him when he makes a right move? There must have been one or two even modest correct decisions, such as pressuring other Nato nations to increase their defense spending, despite his bumbling approach? Throwing the baby out with the bathwater?
My suggestion? Take a page out of youth soccer and have Obama award him a ”Presidential Participation” trophy at the end of his term. He’ll be so tickled he will probably build a custom case to display it.
My American friends are asking me about President Trumps’s observation that the British ‘like him’
I regret this is quite unfounded
The explanation for this canard is that Trump is pronoid
...
Pronoid is the opposite of paranoid. A paranoid person thinks, without any basis in reality, that everybody is out to get them. A pronoid person is someone who thinks, without any basis in reality, that everybody likes them
The fact is that the British loathe Donald Trump
This is because he is the polar opposite of a ‘ Gentleman ‘, who has qualities the British admire. A fine example is Gareth Southgate
To the British, a ‘ Gentleman ' is a man who is modest, well-mannered, self deprecating, quietly intelligent, considerate of other people’s feeling, and well-informed.
He is not vulgar, inflated, vain, boastful, noisily ignorant, sleazy and common as muck
Pressuring them in private is one thing; blasting them in public is another. I am reading opinions that he does so to play to his political base. If there is any truth to that, it is inexplicable that he is doing so and dangerous. Heck, it is inexplicable and dangerous — period.That is not how one manages intricate foreign policy issues/discussions/negotiations.
What bothers me is what appears to be getting lost in the public discussion because of the simplistic way Trump is portraying this. Yes, it would be good for the U.S. if NATO countries increased their defense spending and generally shouldered more of the fiscal responsibility for the joint defense agreement. But the joint defense agreement should not be viewed in these kinds of silos. Trump makes it sound as if we are doing all these countries a favor by defending them and paying for a good chunk of that defense. What is lost: He makes it sound as if America is getting nothing out of it. That it is largely altruistic on our part. That our military installations in these countries are solely for the benefit of those countries — not ours. Obviously, this is false. But I bet there are a lot of people out there who believe — increasingly because of Trump and his tirades — that we should take our ball and go home.
playing devils advocate...why not? Certainly that behaviour was not acceptable under historical mores, but trump and his supporters have clearly said they don't care, as long as its effective. I'm not a Nato expert, but havent these countries already admitted they need to increase spending. Not because of trump, but following Russia/Crimea. Regardless, i dont agree that threatening to pull out of Nato, not that trump could do that alone (see congress message this week supporting Nato), is an effective way to get them to spend more on their own defense.
You know that the system makes it impossible to have a rational conversation about him. I say something positive, he and the GOP shout it from the rooftops that even lefty socialists are championing Trump as the Only One. He knows as well as anyone that conceding a point to him does not earn reciprocation, it just means his pile gets higher. Therefore, fuck him, I give him nothing. When he wants to negotiate in good faith, fine, I'll tell him I like SPD-2.
Yeah, I guess I'm scratching to find something positive. Oh well.
Sure. I get tired of being insulted all day, embarrassed every day, ignored every day, by a president that's supposed to be beholden in some small part to what I want to see. But sure. Rah. Go team.
that's not near the point I'm trying to make. I'm not much of a team player myself. Yes, put him to the fire for the many, many f'ups he makes. But, when he makes those few right decisions, perhaps some encouragement that that's the type of thing we would like to see more of...he is a megalomaniac after all, you'd think he would eat it up so want no play into his faults.
You know that the system makes it impossible to have a rational conversation about him. I say something positive, he and the GOP shout it from the rooftops that even lefty socialists are championing Trump as the Only One. He knows as well as anyone that conceding a point to him does not earn reciprocation, it just means his pile gets higher. Therefore, fuck him, I give him nothing. When he wants to negotiate in good faith, fine, I'll tell him I like SPD-2.
growth rate didnt double either, real gdp went from 1.5% in 2016 to 2.3% in 2017, and still below 2.9% achieved in 2015
Yes, I saw that statistic as well. He repeatedly just makes shit up. It's also his utter disregard for the truth that troubles me; it's not just infuriating, it's dangerous - attempting to create an environment where truth will have no meaning or value.
Yeah, "FAKE NEWS!" I guess he doesn't remember that there is an audio recording of that interview. Still, he's more popular among Republicans than Abraham Lincoln - who was President over 70 years before Presidential polling began. Plus the "GDP has doubled and tripled" since he took office. (2016 GDP - 18.5 trillion, 2017 GDP - 19.3 trillion) Even if he meant the growth rate, he's still way off.
growth rate didnt double either, real gdp went from 1.5% in 2016 to 2.3% in 2017, and still below 2.9% achieved in 2015
Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth
Posted:
Jul 13, 2018 - 7:54am
black321 wrote:
So Trump is obviously regarded by many as a bad president, and by many a bad person. But is the hatred going too far...so far as if we want him to fail, rather than succeed? Is that thinking good for the country? Shouldn't we encourage him when he makes a right move? There must have been one or two even modest correct decisions, such as pressuring other Nato nations to increase their defense spending, despite his bumbling approach? Throwing the baby out with the bathwater?
Pressuring them in private is one thing; blasting them in public is another. I am reading opinions that he does so to play to his political base. If there is any truth to that, it is inexplicable that he is doing so and dangerous. Heck, it is inexplicable and dangerous — period.That is not how one manages intricate foreign policy issues/discussions/negotiations.
What bothers me is what appears to be getting lost in the public discussion because of the simplistic way Trump is portraying this. Yes, it would be good for the U.S. if NATO countries increased their defense spending and generally shouldered more of the fiscal responsibility for the joint defense agreement. But the joint defense agreement should not be viewed in these kinds of silos. Trump makes it sound as if we are doing all these countries a favor by defending them and paying for a good chunk of that defense. What is lost: He makes it sound as if America is getting nothing out of it. That it is largely altruistic on our part. That our military installations in these countries are solely for the benefit of those countries — not ours. Obviously, this is false. But I bet there are a lot of people out there who believe — increasingly because of Trump and his tirades — that we should take our ball and go home.
Donnie Johnnie's concept of reality is utterly malleable.
Yeah, "FAKE NEWS!" I guess he doesn't remember that there is an audio recording of that interview. Still, he's more popular among Republicans than Abraham Lincoln - who was President over 70 years before Presidential polling began. Plus the "GDP has doubled and tripled" since he took office. (2016 GDP - 18.5 trillion, 2017 GDP - 19.3 trillion) Even if he meant the growth rate, he's still way off.
OK fair enough. Lets take the Nato bit. assuming you agree Nato countries should contribute more for their own defense, you still would argue against him because the means - his bumbling attacks of allies - dont justify the ends - getting them to contribute more? You havent seen him do anything completely right yet, so no support. But, IFhe did do something the right way, you would acknowledge it?
Sure. IF he did it within established norms of civilized, diplomatic behavior; not by acting like a bully and a fool. As for NATO, I'd like to see it go away, ultimately.
Yes, I saw that statistic as well. He repeatedly just makes shit up. It's also his utter disregard for the truth that troubles me; it's not just infuriating, it's dangerous - attempting to create an environment where truth will have no meaning or value.
