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Fox Spews - kurtster - Dec 2, 2021 - 8:36pm
 
Joe Biden - Lazy8 - Dec 2, 2021 - 8:24pm
 
Photography Forum - Your Own Photos - fractalv - Dec 2, 2021 - 8:16pm
 
• • • Things Magicians Exclaim • • •  - oldviolin - Dec 2, 2021 - 6:58pm
 
Radio Paradise Comments - oldviolin - Dec 2, 2021 - 6:25pm
 
RightWingNutZ - R_P - Dec 2, 2021 - 5:03pm
 
COVID-19 - R_P - Dec 2, 2021 - 4:56pm
 
short track after short jingle - BillG - Dec 2, 2021 - 3:39pm
 
Things You Thought Today - Antigone - Dec 2, 2021 - 3:25pm
 
Lyrics that strike a chord today... - oldviolin - Dec 2, 2021 - 3:06pm
 
YouTube: Music-Videos - black321 - Dec 2, 2021 - 2:45pm
 
Cryptic Posts - Leave Them Guessing - oldviolin - Dec 2, 2021 - 12:52pm
 
Race in America - R_P - Dec 2, 2021 - 11:19am
 
New Music - black321 - Dec 2, 2021 - 10:48am
 
Talk Behind Their Backs Forum - VV - Dec 2, 2021 - 10:30am
 
Name My Band - GeneP59 - Dec 2, 2021 - 9:00am
 
What did you have for dinner? - GeneP59 - Dec 2, 2021 - 8:43am
 
Radio Paradise NFL Pick'em Group - GeneP59 - Dec 2, 2021 - 8:42am
 
Today in History - Red_Dragon - Dec 2, 2021 - 6:31am
 
Mixtape Culture Club - miamizsun - Dec 2, 2021 - 6:21am
 
The RANT Forum - Red_Dragon - Dec 2, 2021 - 6:05am
 
Dialing 1-800-Manbird - oldviolin - Dec 1, 2021 - 6:56pm
 
Things that are just WRONG - Manbird - Dec 1, 2021 - 6:13pm
 
Trump - Steely_D - Dec 1, 2021 - 5:35pm
 
This Wonderfully Weird World - Red_Dragon - Dec 1, 2021 - 4:01pm
 
Republican Party - Red_Dragon - Dec 1, 2021 - 3:58pm
 
Poetry Forum - miamizsun - Dec 1, 2021 - 3:19pm
 
This Film is not yet Rated - Lazy8 - Dec 1, 2021 - 12:22pm
 
Counting with Pictures - ScottN - Dec 1, 2021 - 10:46am
 
Damn Dinosaurs! - R_P - Dec 1, 2021 - 9:42am
 
Happy Thanksgiving! - GeneP59 - Dec 1, 2021 - 8:46am
 
What is the meaning of this? - oldviolin - Dec 1, 2021 - 7:51am
 
Bear! - Ohmsen - Dec 1, 2021 - 6:50am
 
Environment - Red_Dragon - Dec 1, 2021 - 6:27am
 
That's good advice - Proclivities - Dec 1, 2021 - 6:24am
 
Vinyl Only Spin List - kurtster - Nov 30, 2021 - 9:20pm
 
Sunrise, Sunset - Coaxial - Nov 30, 2021 - 7:30pm
 
What Puts You In the Christmas Mood? - BlueHeronDruid - Nov 30, 2021 - 6:05pm
 
The Daily complaint forum, Please complain or be Happy - ScottFromWyoming - Nov 30, 2021 - 3:59pm
 
Breaking News - Red_Dragon - Nov 30, 2021 - 3:43pm
 
Guns - Red_Dragon - Nov 30, 2021 - 1:52pm
 
The All-Things Beatles Forum - NoEnzLefttoSplit - Nov 30, 2021 - 1:49pm
 
Acoustic Guitar - Ohmsen - Nov 30, 2021 - 9:45am
 
Jazz - Ohmsen - Nov 30, 2021 - 9:38am
 
Tech & Science - Red_Dragon - Nov 30, 2021 - 7:56am
 
Bad Poetry - oldviolin - Nov 30, 2021 - 7:47am
 
Buddy's Haven - oldviolin - Nov 30, 2021 - 7:34am
 
• • • The Once-a-Day • • •  - oldviolin - Nov 30, 2021 - 6:59am
 
Ways to convert list of liked songs into playlist for You... - Aoxomoxoa - Nov 30, 2021 - 3:13am
 
• • • Clownstock • • •  - Manbird - Nov 29, 2021 - 7:11pm
 
Things I want to learn from RadioParadise - Coaxial - Nov 29, 2021 - 6:07pm
 
Robots - Manbird - Nov 29, 2021 - 5:29pm
 
Arlo Guthrie's Alice's Restaurant Massacree - KurtfromLaQuinta - Nov 29, 2021 - 4:38pm
 
Baseball, anyone? - ScottFromWyoming - Nov 29, 2021 - 11:16am
 
Two questions. That's it. I promise. - Manbird - Nov 28, 2021 - 9:11pm
 
What Did You Do Today? - KurtfromLaQuinta - Nov 28, 2021 - 5:41pm
 
Shuttle, ISS and other Real Space Ships - miamizsun - Nov 28, 2021 - 4:37pm
 
Outstanding Covers - oldviolin - Nov 28, 2021 - 7:38am
 
Graphic designers, ho's! - Proclivities - Nov 28, 2021 - 4:48am
 
Funny Videos - KurtfromLaQuinta - Nov 27, 2021 - 9:27pm
 
Great Old Songs You Rarely Hear Anymore - KurtfromLaQuinta - Nov 27, 2021 - 7:54pm
 
Mr. & Mrs Levigne's rejected baby name list... - ScottFromWyoming - Nov 27, 2021 - 7:49pm
 
What Are You Grateful For? - oldviolin - Nov 27, 2021 - 5:27pm
 
The Obituary Page - Antigone - Nov 26, 2021 - 3:57pm
 
More reggae, less Marley please - rhahl - Nov 26, 2021 - 2:08pm
 
Coffee - miamizsun - Nov 26, 2021 - 5:55am
 
Old Time and Folk - Lazy8 - Nov 25, 2021 - 5:19pm
 
Life Imitates the movies? - oldviolin - Nov 25, 2021 - 7:22am
 
Live Music - R_P - Nov 24, 2021 - 9:22pm
 
Animal Resistance - Manbird - Nov 24, 2021 - 7:55pm
 
♥ ♥ ♥ Vote For Pie ♥ ♥ ♥ - haresfur - Nov 24, 2021 - 4:05pm
 
Other Medical Stuff - westslope - Nov 24, 2021 - 8:22am
 
Derplahoma! - Red_Dragon - Nov 24, 2021 - 7:39am
 
Play the Blues - rhahl - Nov 24, 2021 - 2:37am
 
songs that ROCK! - rhahl - Nov 23, 2021 - 10:54pm
 
Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » The Obituary Page Page: 1, 2, 3 ... 60, 61, 62  Next
Post to this Topic
Antigone

Antigone Avatar

Location: A house, in a Virginian Valley
Gender: Female


Posted: Nov 26, 2021 - 3:57pm


Stephen Sondheim.  I thought he would live forever ... and in a way, he will.



miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 14, 2021 - 6:06am

 kurtster wrote: 
{#Meditate}
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 13, 2021 - 6:40pm

Moody Blues drummer Graeme Edge dies aged 80
Steely_D

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Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 9, 2021 - 8:34pm

 Proclivities wrote:

Oh boy.
oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 9, 2021 - 2:14pm

 Proclivities wrote:
 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


He was in so many things I'd forgotten about. Blue Velvet is unforgettable though.

The Boy With Green Hair
 
Dr. Wellington Yueh
Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 9, 2021 - 1:47pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


He was in so many things I'd forgotten about. Blue Velvet is unforgettable though.

The Boy With Green Hair
JrzyTmata

JrzyTmata Avatar



Posted: Nov 9, 2021 - 1:20pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


He was in so many things I'd forgotten about. Blue Velvet is unforgettable though.

Herbie The Love Bug


ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 9, 2021 - 1:02pm

 Proclivities wrote:

He was in so many things I'd forgotten about. Blue Velvet is unforgettable though.
Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 9, 2021 - 12:09pm

Dean Stockwell, ‘Quantum Leap’ and ‘Blue Velvet’ Star, Dead at 85
Coaxial

Coaxial Avatar

Location: 543 miles west of Paradis,1491 miles eas
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 8, 2021 - 4:42am

 Lazy8 wrote:
 
Three members dead since June...Sad.{#Meditate}
ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2021 - 3:25pm

 Lazy8 wrote:





Lazy8

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Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2021 - 9:25am


kurtster

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Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Oct 27, 2021 - 6:57am

Mort Sahl
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Oct 20, 2021 - 2:28pm

 haresfur wrote:


Soft serve of course. No one is happy about the hard truth


That's the trouble with the world, I tell ya.
haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Oct 20, 2021 - 2:22pm

 oldviolin wrote:

lol. Soft serve or no?




Soft serve of course. No one is happy about the hard truth
oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Oct 20, 2021 - 1:00am

 islander wrote:


According to the signs I followed, I should be on the trail of Ice cream and margaritas. If there happens to be truth along the way, we'll pick some up. 

lol. Soft serve or no?


islander

islander Avatar

Location: Seattle
Gender: Male


Posted: Oct 19, 2021 - 9:51pm

 oldviolin wrote:


And last, if Trump hates him, he must have been on the trail of finding his way to truth. After all, isn't that what we're all trying to do? Otherwise...



According to the signs I followed, I should be on the trail of Ice cream and margaritas. If there happens to be truth along the way, we'll pick some up. 
oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Oct 19, 2021 - 7:14pm

 kcar wrote:
 Red_Dragon wrote:While the Mintwood article is interesting, it's not clear how much influence the State Dept's Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR)  had. The piece also does not make clear what evidence the INR had to make its assessments that many points of Powell's speech (in draft at the time of the INR report) were "weak." As I write below, the US intelligence community (16 agencies) had published a National Intelligence Estimate stating that Iraq had WMDs. 
 
Check out this 2016 Frontline interview with Powell for his take on the speech and the conditions he worked under. He was given about 4 days by the White House to prepare for the UN speech. President GW Bush had already made up his mind to invade Iraq and had obtained Congressional approval to do so. There were MANY people in Congress who thought there was sufficient evidence and cause to invade btw. The White House had given Powell a speech to use (IIRC prepared by Cheney's staff) that Powell thought was wholly inadequate and filled with claims that "did not track."  I don't know if Powell read or considered the INR assessment of the points of his speech in its draft state. Powell said he felt comfortable drafting a new speech based on the National Intelligence Estimate on Iraq's apparent WMD programs as well as his consultations with the CIA about the NIE in the four days before the UN speech.  Powell went to the UN to gain support from the UN member states for possible invasion but mostly to pressure Iraq to allow UN inspections for WMDs and thus PREVENT war. Powell persuaded Bush to go to the UN because he knew Iraq could be a quagmire for occupying US troops. Powell used the "Pottery Barn rule" analogy to persuade Bush: if you break it (invade Iraq), you own it.  Powell's words, from the Frontline interview linked to above: 

You have to remember that at the time I gave the speech on Feb. 5, the president had already made this decision for military action. The dice had been tossed. That’s what we were going to do. The Congress had passed a resolution three months before that speech that essentially gave the president the authorization to do it. Overwhelmingly they voted for it, and it was on the basis of that National Intelligence Estimate. The president had been using these very significant points about biological vans and chemical weapons in his speeches and in the State of the Union address. There was really nothing in my speech that hadn’t already been covered in the State of the Union or other speeches.

The reason I went to the U.N. is because we needed now to put the case before the entire international community in a powerful way, and that’s what I did that day.

Of course walking into that room is always a daunting experience, but I had been there before. And we had projectors and all sorts of technology to help us make the case. And that’s what I did. I made the case with the director of central intelligence sitting behind me. He and his team had vouched for everything in it. We didn’t make up anything. We threw out a lot of stuff that was not double- and triple-sourced, because I knew the importance of this.

When I was through, I felt pretty good about it. I thought we had made the case, and there was pretty good reaction to it for a few weeks. And then suddenly, the CIA started to let us know that the case was falling apart — parts of the case were falling apart. It was deeply disturbing to me and to the president, to all of us, and to the Congress, because they had voted on the basis of that information. And 16 intelligence agencies had agreed to it, with footnotes. None of the footnotes took away their agreement.


Powell put his trust in the US intelligence community and it failed him. The intelligence community had been under tremendous pressure to link Saddam to WMDs and Al Qaeda and thus justify invasion. Cheney was the leader of that. 

In slight defense of Cheney, I'll note that I saw another Frontline special that shed light on Cheney's thinking. Cheney was SecDef during the Gulf War and was deeply shocked by the post-war revelation that Saddam had a well-advanced nuclear weapons program. The US intelligence community did not know about this at all IIRC. The memory of that revelation and the failure of President GW Bush and VP Cheney's administration to prevent 9/11 (despite CIA Director Tenet's frantic warnings during the spring and summer of 2001) led Cheney to wrongly believe Saddam was cooperating with Al Qaeda and presented a viable post-9/11 threat to the US. 

 

 
Perhaps relative to this, here's what an op/ed from toward the end of '04 had to say upon his anticipated
(somewhat disillusioned) departure from The Bush Administration as Secretary Of State for a second term...

sorry. Dont know how to do a proper link:

https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/the-truth-about-colin-powell/

This one somewhat more critical from '08.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2008/10/powells-cautionary-tale/307099/

And last, if Trump hates him, he must have been on the trail of finding his way to truth. After all, isn't that what we're all trying to do? Otherwise...
kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: Oct 19, 2021 - 6:07pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:

While the Mintwood article is interesting, it's not clear how much influence the State Dept's Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR)  had. The piece also does not make clear what evidence the INR had to make its assessments that many points of Powell's speech (in draft at the time of the INR report) were "weak." As I write below, the US intelligence community (16 agencies) had published a National Intelligence Estimate stating that Iraq had WMDs. 
 
Check out this 2016 Frontline interview with Powell for his take on the speech and the conditions he worked under. He was given about 4 days by the White House to prepare for the UN speech. President GW Bush had already made up his mind to invade Iraq and had obtained Congressional approval to do so. There were MANY people in Congress who thought there was sufficient evidence and cause to invade btw. The White House had given Powell a speech to use (IIRC prepared by Cheney's staff) that Powell thought was wholly inadequate and filled with claims that "did not track." 

I don't know if Powell read or considered the INR assessment of the points of his speech in its draft state. Powell said he felt comfortable drafting a new speech based on the National Intelligence Estimate on Iraq's apparent WMD programs as well as his consultations with the CIA about the NIE in the four days before the UN speech. 

Powell went to the UN to gain support from the UN member states for possible invasion but mostly to pressure Iraq to allow UN inspections for WMDs and thus PREVENT war. Powell persuaded Bush to go to the UN because he knew Iraq could be a quagmire for occupying US troops. Powell used the "Pottery Barn rule" analogy to persuade Bush: if you break it (invade Iraq), you own it. 

Powell's words, from the Frontline interview linked to above: 

You have to remember that at the time I gave the speech on Feb. 5, the president had already made this decision for military action. The dice had been tossed. That’s what we were going to do. The Congress had passed a resolution three months before that speech that essentially gave the president the authorization to do it. Overwhelmingly they voted for it, and it was on the basis of that National Intelligence Estimate. The president had been using these very significant points about biological vans and chemical weapons in his speeches and in the State of the Union address. There was really nothing in my speech that hadn’t already been covered in the State of the Union or other speeches.

The reason I went to the U.N. is because we needed now to put the case before the entire international community in a powerful way, and that’s what I did that day.

Of course walking into that room is always a daunting experience, but I had been there before. And we had projectors and all sorts of technology to help us make the case. And that’s what I did. I made the case with the director of central intelligence sitting behind me. He and his team had vouched for everything in it. We didn’t make up anything. We threw out a lot of stuff that was not double- and triple-sourced, because I knew the importance of this.

When I was through, I felt pretty good about it. I thought we had made the case, and there was pretty good reaction to it for a few weeks. And then suddenly, the CIA started to let us know that the case was falling apart — parts of the case were falling apart. It was deeply disturbing to me and to the president, to all of us, and to the Congress, because they had voted on the basis of that information. And 16 intelligence agencies had agreed to it, with footnotes. None of the footnotes took away their agreement.


Powell put his trust in the US intelligence community and it failed him. The intelligence community had been under tremendous pressure to link Saddam to WMDs and Al Qaeda and thus justify invasion. Cheney was the leader of that. 

In slight defense of Cheney, I'll note that I saw another Frontline special that shed light on Cheney's thinking. Cheney was SecDef during the Gulf War and was deeply shocked by the post-war revelation that Saddam had a well-advanced nuclear weapons program. The US intelligence community did not know about this at all IIRC. The memory of that revelation and the failure of President GW Bush and VP Cheney's administration to prevent 9/11 (despite CIA Director Tenet's frantic warnings during the spring and summer of 2001) led Cheney to wrongly believe Saddam was cooperating with Al Qaeda and presented a viable post-9/11 threat to the US. 


Ohmsen

Ohmsen Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Oct 19, 2021 - 8:22am

 oldviolin wrote:
LOL. Don't get bogged down in my sediment. Wait, I mean sentiment!  I can master disaster with but a thought; often misunderstood...
{#Wink}

Wasn't even taking it personal. Love, honey...  
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