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Radio Paradise Comments - miamizsun - Jul 31, 2021 - 6:20am
 
Great Old Songs You Rarely Hear Anymore - sirdroseph - Jul 31, 2021 - 4:33am
 
Back to the 70's - sirdroseph - Jul 31, 2021 - 4:26am
 
COVID-19 - sirdroseph - Jul 31, 2021 - 4:07am
 
That's good advice - sirdroseph - Jul 31, 2021 - 3:41am
 
Sweet horrible irony. - sirdroseph - Jul 31, 2021 - 3:32am
 
Get the Quote - sirdroseph - Jul 31, 2021 - 3:23am
 
Things You Thought Today - the_jake - Jul 30, 2021 - 9:17pm
 
Trump - haresfur - Jul 30, 2021 - 9:00pm
 
Talk Behind Their Backs Forum - winter - Jul 30, 2021 - 8:26pm
 
Baseball, anyone? - steeler - Jul 30, 2021 - 5:18pm
 
Bug Reports & Feature Requests - halogen - Jul 30, 2021 - 2:22pm
 
New Music - sirdroseph - Jul 30, 2021 - 1:20pm
 
• • • The Once-a-Day • • •  - sirdroseph - Jul 30, 2021 - 9:42am
 
The Obituary Page - GeneP59 - Jul 30, 2021 - 9:39am
 
What is the meaning of this? - Proclivities - Jul 30, 2021 - 7:34am
 
Health Care - miamizsun - Jul 30, 2021 - 6:55am
 
TV shows you watch - maryte - Jul 30, 2021 - 6:35am
 
Automotive Lust - NoEnzLefttoSplit - Jul 30, 2021 - 6:21am
 
The Rpeeps Favorite Guitarists Thread - sirdroseph - Jul 30, 2021 - 4:49am
 
ISO Android app usage guide - kbs - Jul 30, 2021 - 3:45am
 
Little known information...maybe even facts - haresfur - Jul 30, 2021 - 2:20am
 
Surfing! - whatshisname - Jul 29, 2021 - 11:14pm
 
Counting with Pictures - ScottN - Jul 29, 2021 - 7:28pm
 
Zappa - black321 - Jul 29, 2021 - 1:56pm
 
Environment - R_P - Jul 29, 2021 - 1:40pm
 
All Dogs Go To Heaven - Dog Pix - black321 - Jul 29, 2021 - 12:46pm
 
Race in America - R_P - Jul 29, 2021 - 11:46am
 
Hot Dog... it's Summer! - Proclivities - Jul 29, 2021 - 10:54am
 
Music documentaries - Ohmsen - Jul 29, 2021 - 10:02am
 
Capitalism and Consumerism... now what? - black321 - Jul 29, 2021 - 8:47am
 
Philosophy (Meaty Metaphysical Munchables!) - sirdroseph - Jul 29, 2021 - 7:57am
 
Derplahoma! - ScottFromWyoming - Jul 28, 2021 - 10:39pm
 
RightWingNutZ - Red_Dragon - Jul 28, 2021 - 6:11pm
 
The Military Industrial Complex - westslope - Jul 28, 2021 - 5:36pm
 
Celebrity Deaths - _Bruce_ - Jul 28, 2021 - 3:51pm
 
Tech & Science - Red_Dragon - Jul 28, 2021 - 3:42pm
 
What did you have for lunch? - oldviolin - Jul 28, 2021 - 1:32pm
 
Live Music - R_P - Jul 28, 2021 - 12:42pm
 
~ Have a good joke you can post? ~ - oldviolin - Jul 28, 2021 - 8:27am
 
how do you feel right now? - Antigone - Jul 28, 2021 - 8:22am
 
Today in History - ColdMiser - Jul 28, 2021 - 6:51am
 
The Chomsky / Zinn Reader - rhahl - Jul 28, 2021 - 6:32am
 
Poetry Forum - ScottN - Jul 28, 2021 - 6:09am
 
Living in America - NoEnzLefttoSplit - Jul 27, 2021 - 11:04pm
 
• • • BRING OUT YOUR DEAD • • •  - oldviolin - Jul 27, 2021 - 8:35pm
 
Photos you have taken of your walks or hikes. - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jul 27, 2021 - 4:47pm
 
HALF A WORLD - Ohmsen - Jul 27, 2021 - 3:48pm
 
I swing therefore I am. - rhahl - Jul 27, 2021 - 12:46pm
 
Beer - the_jake - Jul 27, 2021 - 10:29am
 
Olympics - Is anybody interested - sirdroseph - Jul 27, 2021 - 9:10am
 
MQA Stream Coming to BLUOS - Cebolla - Jul 27, 2021 - 9:00am
 
Mixtape Culture Club - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jul 26, 2021 - 9:23pm
 
One Reason I Don't Trust the Police - Red_Dragon - Jul 26, 2021 - 7:54pm
 
KUDOS for BillG - kenmo - Jul 26, 2021 - 4:34pm
 
Climate Change - Red_Dragon - Jul 26, 2021 - 3:48pm
 
Gotta Get Your Drink On - haresfur - Jul 25, 2021 - 8:14pm
 
Fake News*  ?  ! - R_P - Jul 25, 2021 - 5:04pm
 
Lyrics that strike a chord today... - Steely_D - Jul 25, 2021 - 2:40pm
 
Nobel Prize Literature - rhahl - Jul 25, 2021 - 2:36pm
 
Comics! - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jul 25, 2021 - 2:01pm
 
Name My Band - oldviolin - Jul 25, 2021 - 11:40am
 
It's fine - rhahl - Jul 25, 2021 - 9:34am
 
Property rights and violence in the USA - westslope - Jul 25, 2021 - 9:27am
 
• • •  What's For Dinner ? • • •  - Antigone - Jul 25, 2021 - 4:32am
 
Bob Dylan - Steely_D - Jul 24, 2021 - 10:58pm
 
Outstanding Covers - Steely_D - Jul 24, 2021 - 10:41pm
 
The Future is here! - Red_Dragon - Jul 24, 2021 - 4:58pm
 
DQ (as in 'Daily Quote') - Manbird - Jul 24, 2021 - 2:40pm
 
Getting disconnected/paused at bumper time - coding_to_music - Jul 24, 2021 - 11:41am
 
Drones - Prodigal_SOB - Jul 24, 2021 - 11:37am
 
Webcasting rates going up again cry - kenmo - Jul 24, 2021 - 9:56am
 
punk? hip-hop? metal? noise? garage? - sirdroseph - Jul 24, 2021 - 6:14am
 
The War On You - sirdroseph - Jul 24, 2021 - 5:25am
 
Media Bias - sirdroseph - Jul 24, 2021 - 5:16am
 
Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » Environment Page: 1, 2, 3 ... 57, 58, 59  Next
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R_P

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Posted: Jul 29, 2021 - 1:40pm

Plants Feel Pain and Might Even See
It’s time to retire the hierarchical classification of living things.
In 2018, a German newspaper asked me if I would be interested in having a conversation with the philosopher Emanuele Coccia, who had just written a book about plants, Die Wurzeln der Welt (published in English as The Life of Plants). I was happy to say yes.

The German title of Coccia’s book translates as “The Roots of the World,” and the book really does cover this. It upends our view of the living world, putting plants at the top of the hierarchy with humans down at the bottom. I had been giving a great deal of thought to this myself. Ranking the natural world and scoring species according to their importance or their superiority seemed to me outdated. It distorts our view of nature and makes all the other species around us seem more primitive and somehow unfinished. For some time now, I have not been comfortable with viewing humans as the crown of creation, separating animals into higher and lower life-forms, and treating plants as something on the side, definitively banished to a lower level. (...)

After our first cup of coffee, we were soon deep into our main topic: trees and plants in general. Coccia argued that our biological classifications are not grounded in science. They are strongly influenced by theology and are dominated by two ideas: the supremacy of the human race and the world as a place humans must bend to their will. And then there is our centuries-old compulsion to categorize everything. When you combine these concepts, you get a ranking system that puts humankind at the top, animals in the middle, and plants way down at the bottom.

I listened, fascinated by what he had to say. Here was a man of my own heart. I would prefer it, I told Coccia, if science categorized species one beside the other. That would still allow an order, a system of sorting, without imposing any kind of a hierarchy. He immediately agreed. He reiterated his belief that the ordering system we have today is not scientific but rather influenced by cultural, historical, and religious values. For Coccia, the hard boundary between the plant and animal world does not exist. He believes plants can experience sensations and even reflect on them. And he is not the only one who thinks this. (...)

Baluška was ready with other quite different discoveries. There’s a vine that grows in South America that adapts to the form of the tree or bush it is climbing on. Its leaves look just like the leaves on the host plant. You might think this is chemically controlled. In that case, the vine might be detecting scent compounds from the bush and changing the shape of its leaves in a way that was genetically predetermined. Three different leaf shapes had been observed. Then a researcher came up with the idea of creating an artificial plant with plastic leaves and relocating our botanical chameleon to its new home. What happened next was amazing. The vine imitated the artificial leaves, just as it had imitated the leaves in nature. For Baluška this is clear proof that the vine can see. How else could it get information about a shape it had never encountered before? In this case, the usual suspects—chemical messages released by the host plant or electric signals between both plants—were absent. He went further. In his opinion, it is conceivable that all plants might be able to see. (...)

black321

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Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 24, 2021 - 6:53am

 miamizsun wrote:

for the plastophobes among us?






Funny to think of something that is critical to breaking things down, could be used to protect.
miamizsun

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Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 24, 2021 - 6:10am

it was only a matter of time  


miamizsun

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Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 24, 2021 - 5:57am

for the plastophobes among us?




Red_Dragon

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Posted: Jun 24, 2021 - 5:54am

Gas infrastructure across Europe leaking planet-warming methane
Ohmsen

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Location: Hermania
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 16, 2021 - 1:34pm



              Massive piece of junk tossed from ISS... 
              (2.9 tons of nickel-hydrogen batteries)
Red_Dragon

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Posted: Mar 13, 2021 - 8:39am

After Ice
Ohmsen

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Location: Hermania
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 15, 2021 - 4:07pm


R_P

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Posted: Jan 28, 2021 - 10:14am


NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 1:15pm

 westslope wrote:


 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

Sorry, but been burnt once. NZ installed quotas early on and I lived in blissful ignorance for ten years thinking we had well-managed fish stocks. Turned out it was bullshit. This is not about virtue signalling (which you have flagged up with me before - duly noted) but a change in consumer mindset. We just have to stop eating wild fish. Period. And this includes farmed fish fed on wild fish. Everything else is just whitewash. 
 

Well then, why not reform those quota fisheries that are in your opinion failing?

Is social cooperation that difficult in New Zealand?  Do your regard people in New Zealand and around the world as culturally deficient, i.e., incapable of solving the simplest of social dilemmas?   
 
That's not the point. Every fish you take out of an already heavily stressed environment, just adds to the stress on that environment. It is time we learned to leave them well alone (which would be to solve the social dilemma, which, being social, is never simple), at least until they start to resemble something normal, which at last count, none of the marine environments are close to.
westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 12:41pm



 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

Sorry, but been burnt once. NZ installed quotas early on and I lived in blissful ignorance for ten years thinking we had well-managed fish stocks. Turned out it was bullshit. This is not about virtue signalling (which you have flagged up with me before - duly noted) but a change in consumer mindset. We just have to stop eating wild fish. Period. And this includes farmed fish fed on wild fish. Everything else is just whitewash. 
 

Well then, why not reform those quota fisheries that are in your opinion failing?

Is social cooperation that difficult in New Zealand?  Do your regard people in New Zealand and around the world as culturally deficient, i.e., incapable of solving the simplest of social dilemmas?   
ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 12:21pm



 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

How's it going? Lost your sense of taste? Short of breath?  (praying for neither! 
{#Meditate}
)
 

(moved to RPeep News)
NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 12:12pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

I'm kind of ambivalent about this. The scientist in me says yes, wholeheartedly. The rest of me is going to need some reconditioning. 
 
Get the covid so your taste buds die, then the only thing you have to overcome is the texture.

 
How's it going? Lost your sense of taste? Short of breath?  (praying for neither! {#Meditate})
ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 12:09pm



 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

I'm kind of ambivalent about this. The scientist in me says yes, wholeheartedly. The rest of me is going to need some reconditioning. 
 
Get the covid so your taste buds die, then the only thing you have to overcome is the texture.

NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 11:55am

 Red_Dragon wrote:


 miamizsun wrote:


i'll eat lab grown fish or powdered fish-like protein pills (same for other animal like proteins)

i'm synthetic memetic compliant
 

I'm very much looking forward to lab-produced meats and fish; seriously.
 
I'm kind of ambivalent about this. The scientist in me says yes, wholeheartedly. The rest of me is going to need some reconditioning. 
miamizsun

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Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 11:44am

 Red_Dragon wrote:
 miamizsun wrote:
i'll eat lab grown fish or powdered fish-like protein pills (same for other animal like proteins)

i'm synthetic memetic compliant
 

I'm very much looking forward to lab-produced meats and fish; seriously.
 

me too

but if it means saving humanity will you eat soylent gop?

because if you will...
Red_Dragon

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Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 11:40am



 miamizsun wrote:


i'll eat lab grown fish or powdered fish-like protein pills (same for other animal like proteins)

i'm synthetic memetic compliant
 

I'm very much looking forward to lab-produced meats and fish; seriously.
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 11:25am

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

Sorry, but been burnt once. NZ installed quotas early on and I lived in blissful ignorance for ten years thinking we had well-managed fish stocks. Turned out it was bullshit. This is not about virtue signalling (which you have flagged up with me before - duly noted) but a change in consumer mindset. We just have to stop eating wild fish. Period. And this includes farmed fish fed on wild fish. Everything else is just whitewash. 
 

i'll eat lab grown fish or powdered fish-like protein pills (same for other animal like proteins)

i'm synthetic memetic compliant
NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 10:52am

 westslope wrote:


 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

Yikes.  

We stopped eating any saltwater fish (including aqua-culture) last year. There has to be an immediate global moratorium on fishing to give to oceans time to recover (and even that might not be enough). 
 
No.

There has to be a continuing move to tradeable quota fisheries from open access chaos.  Moratoria are great for heart-warming  virtue signalling but it will not work.

For an example of well managed international quota fishery, see the Pacific Halibut fishery.

 
Sorry, but been burnt once. NZ installed quotas early on and I lived in blissful ignorance for ten years thinking we had well-managed fish stocks. Turned out it was bullshit. This is not about virtue signalling (which you have flagged up with me before - duly noted) but a change in consumer mindset. We just have to stop eating wild fish. Period. And this includes farmed fish fed on wild fish. Everything else is just whitewash. 
westslope

westslope Avatar

Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Jan 27, 2021 - 10:45am



 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

Yikes.  

We stopped eating any saltwater fish (including aqua-culture) last year. There has to be an immediate global moratorium on fishing to give to oceans time to recover (and even that might not be enough). 
 
No.

There has to be a continuing move to tradeable quota fisheries from open access chaos.  Moratoria are great for heart-warming  virtue signalling but it will not work.

For an example of well managed international quota fishery, see the Pacific Halibut fishery.

Page: 1, 2, 3 ... 57, 58, 59  Next