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COVID-19 - R_P - Sep 18, 2021 - 12:27am
 
Trump - islander - Sep 17, 2021 - 6:52pm
 
Australia has Disappeared - haresfur - Sep 17, 2021 - 6:33pm
 
Marijuana: Baked News. - Red_Dragon - Sep 17, 2021 - 5:50pm
 
Mixtape Culture Club - KurtfromLaQuinta - Sep 17, 2021 - 4:57pm
 
Things You Thought Today - oldviolin - Sep 17, 2021 - 3:07pm
 
The Best Commercials - miamizsun - Sep 17, 2021 - 3:07pm
 
Radio Paradise Comments - miamizsun - Sep 17, 2021 - 2:26pm
 
Google Assistant not streaming RP Main Mix - jarro - Sep 17, 2021 - 1:53pm
 
Pernicious Pious Proclivities Particularized Prodigiously - R_P - Sep 17, 2021 - 10:20am
 
Terrorist Watch! - Red_Dragon - Sep 17, 2021 - 5:37am
 
Derplahoma! - sunybuny - Sep 17, 2021 - 5:33am
 
SFW & Gluttony Pants - miamizsun - Sep 17, 2021 - 4:50am
 
What the hell OV? - miamizsun - Sep 17, 2021 - 4:23am
 
As California Goes, So Goes The Rest Of The Country - haresfur - Sep 17, 2021 - 1:20am
 
NASA & other news from space - miamizsun - Sep 16, 2021 - 6:52pm
 
Military Matters - R_P - Sep 16, 2021 - 5:02pm
 
Taxes, Taxes, Taxes (and Taxes) - westslope - Sep 16, 2021 - 2:54pm
 
New Music - R_P - Sep 16, 2021 - 12:59pm
 
Joe Biden - Red_Dragon - Sep 16, 2021 - 11:54am
 
Name My Band - Lindo525 - Sep 16, 2021 - 11:32am
 
All Dogs Go To Heaven - Dog Pix - Prodigal_SOB - Sep 16, 2021 - 10:12am
 
The Dragons' Roost - GeneP59 - Sep 16, 2021 - 9:59am
 
Radio Paradise NFL Pick'em Group - Proclivities - Sep 16, 2021 - 9:43am
 
volcano! - NoEnzLefttoSplit - Sep 16, 2021 - 9:25am
 
Photography Forum - Your Own Photos - fractalv - Sep 16, 2021 - 9:02am
 
Music documentaries - oldviolin - Sep 16, 2021 - 6:42am
 
HALF A WORLD - miamizsun - Sep 16, 2021 - 4:42am
 
Spambags on RP - Steely_D - Sep 16, 2021 - 3:36am
 
RightWingNutZ - Red_Dragon - Sep 15, 2021 - 4:25pm
 
Are you ready for some football? - Red_Dragon - Sep 15, 2021 - 4:18pm
 
Star Trek - miamizsun - Sep 15, 2021 - 3:07pm
 
what the hell, miamizsun? - oldviolin - Sep 15, 2021 - 2:20pm
 
What is the meaning of this? - Kilgoretrout - Sep 15, 2021 - 1:03pm
 
COVID and China's Influence - coding_to_music - Sep 15, 2021 - 12:43pm
 
COVID and Children - coding_to_music - Sep 15, 2021 - 12:37pm
 
COVID and Eugenics - coding_to_music - Sep 15, 2021 - 12:27pm
 
COVID lockdowns and mandates - coding_to_music - Sep 15, 2021 - 12:23pm
 
COVID notable people - coding_to_music - Sep 15, 2021 - 12:21pm
 
The Abortion Wars - R_P - Sep 15, 2021 - 11:20am
 
Poetry Forum - oldviolin - Sep 15, 2021 - 10:24am
 
Cryptic Posts - Leave Them Guessing - oldviolin - Sep 15, 2021 - 10:12am
 
• • • The Once-a-Day • • •  - oldviolin - Sep 15, 2021 - 10:11am
 
The Obituary Page - ptooey - Sep 15, 2021 - 10:00am
 
Album recommendation for fans of pop music - Proclivities - Sep 15, 2021 - 9:40am
 
Let's build a city - Red_Dragon - Sep 15, 2021 - 8:46am
 
Best of George Carlin - Jonathon - Sep 15, 2021 - 8:34am
 
*** PUNS *** PINK FLOYD - coding_to_music - Sep 14, 2021 - 9:49pm
 
Little known information...maybe even facts - haresfur - Sep 14, 2021 - 6:59pm
 
Things for which you would sell ManBird's soul - haresfur - Sep 14, 2021 - 4:27pm
 
Fox Spews - R_P - Sep 14, 2021 - 2:16pm
 
But Why? - Manbird - Sep 14, 2021 - 2:12pm
 
Looking back - Ohmsen - Sep 14, 2021 - 10:29am
 
Baseball, anyone? - ScottFromWyoming - Sep 14, 2021 - 10:06am
 
TV shows you watch - Ohmsen - Sep 14, 2021 - 9:32am
 
Florida - sunybuny - Sep 14, 2021 - 8:20am
 
Things that piss me off - black321 - Sep 14, 2021 - 8:17am
 
Manbird's Episiotomy Stitch Licking Clinic - KEEP OUT - miamizsun - Sep 14, 2021 - 5:07am
 
Favorite Quotes - coding_to_music - Sep 13, 2021 - 4:49pm
 
TEXAS - Red_Dragon - Sep 13, 2021 - 4:30pm
 
Song title? - oldviolin - Sep 13, 2021 - 3:41pm
 
Infinite cat - miamizsun - Sep 13, 2021 - 2:46pm
 
Afghanistan - black321 - Sep 13, 2021 - 1:24pm
 
Vinyl Only Spin List - kurtster - Sep 13, 2021 - 11:11am
 
September 11 Theories - coding_to_music - Sep 13, 2021 - 10:39am
 
For Jrzy! - JrzyTmata - Sep 13, 2021 - 8:15am
 
Jam! (why should a song stop) - rhahl - Sep 13, 2021 - 7:24am
 
Counting with Pictures - ScottN - Sep 13, 2021 - 6:58am
 
Brexit - coding_to_music - Sep 12, 2021 - 10:38pm
 
Republican Party - R_P - Sep 12, 2021 - 6:24pm
 
What Makes You Cry :) ? - haresfur - Sep 12, 2021 - 4:26pm
 
Democratic Party - Red_Dragon - Sep 12, 2021 - 3:41pm
 
Today in History - Red_Dragon - Sep 12, 2021 - 3:27pm
 
Two questions. That's it. I promise. - Ohmsen - Sep 12, 2021 - 11:41am
 
What Makes You Laugh? - Ohmsen - Sep 12, 2021 - 9:56am
 
Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » COVID-19 Page: 1, 2, 3 ... 272, 273, 274  Next
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R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 18, 2021 - 12:27am

 Manbird wrote:
Also, I'll bet the newer, more deadly strain becoming the predominant virus has something to do with it, too, as well.

Yes.

Manbird

Manbird Avatar

Location: Owl Creek Bridge
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 18, 2021 - 12:25am

 R_P wrote:

There's now more COVID to go around (with some asymptomatic vaccinated people) and it has had time to get to more places. A surge is a surge is a surge (see quotes). Vaccinated people are less likely to die (which was the whole point). A fair amount of people have been vaccinated. Before vaccinations began all deaths were among the unvaccinated.


The current rate looks slower than the initial outbreak and similar to the winter rate. At no point do the charts reach zero.


Also, I'll bet the newer, more deadly strain becoming the predominant virus has something to do with it, too, as well.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:58pm

 kurtster wrote:
Again, the question is why is the death rate higher among the unvaccinated now then before vaccinations began.

There's now more COVID to go around (with some asymptomatic vaccinated people) and it has had time to get to more places. A surge is a surge is a surge (see quotes). Vaccinated people are less likely to die (which was the whole point). A fair amount of people have been vaccinated. Before vaccinations began all deaths were among the unvaccinated.


The current rate looks slower than the initial outbreak and similar to the winter rate. At no point do the charts reach zero.
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:51pm

 R_P wrote:
 kurtster wrote:

Miss.  That pertains to why you might get infected.  Not why you are going to die from it.

More sick = more dying. Esp. when unvaccinated.

The surge has multiple propellants. The delta variant, which transmits more easily between people, is one.

Delta, originally detected in India and first diagnosed in the United States in March, rapidly replaced other variants to become dominant. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates delta is responsible for more than 8 in 10 new cases.

Another major contributor, epidemiologists said: Relaxing precautions, such as no longer wearing masks or engaging in social distancing. That probably includes behavior even among the vaccinated, Columbia University epidemiologist Jeffrey Shaman said.

Shaman suspects cases among vaccinated people, known as breakthrough infections, are much higher than official tallies indicate. That could be because vaccinated people are less likely to get tested. Or they may be apt to dismiss a mild case of covid-19, the disease caused by the virus, as simply the sniffles. “The central issue is that people want to put the pandemic and the virus behind them,” he said, offering as examples unmasked crowds packed into bars and ballparks.
 
Again, the question is why is the

death rate among the unvaccinated

higher now than before vaccinations began ?

That is the information that Scott presented.  Or did I misinterpret it ?

I do not know how I can make the question any simpler.  Perhaps I only think that I am typing in English.

I guess that I really am the stupidest person here since no one understands anything I say anymore. 

Later.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:40pm

 kurtster wrote:

Miss.  That pertains to why you might get infected.  Not why you are going to die from it.

More sick = more dying. Esp. when unvaccinated.

The surge has multiple propellants. The delta variant, which transmits more easily between people, is one.

Delta, originally detected in India and first diagnosed in the United States in March, rapidly replaced other variants to become dominant. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates delta is responsible for more than 8 in 10 new cases.

Another major contributor, epidemiologists said: Relaxing precautions, such as no longer wearing masks or engaging in social distancing. That probably includes behavior even among the vaccinated, Columbia University epidemiologist Jeffrey Shaman said.

Shaman suspects cases among vaccinated people, known as breakthrough infections, are much higher than official tallies indicate. That could be because vaccinated people are less likely to get tested. Or they may be apt to dismiss a mild case of covid-19, the disease caused by the virus, as simply the sniffles.

“The central issue is that people want to put the pandemic and the virus behind them,” he said, offering as examples unmasked crowds packed into bars and ballparks.
Some data suggest the Delta variant might cause more severe illness than previous variants in unvaccinated people.
In two different studies from Canada and Scotland, patients infected with the Delta variant were more likely to be hospitalized than patients infected with Alpha or the original virus that causes COVID-19. Even so, the vast majority of hospitalization and death caused by COVID-19 are in unvaccinated people.

kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:31pm

 R_P wrote:
 kurtster wrote:
That the death rate of the unvaccinated has basically doubled over that time is profound. Why is that ? What has changed that much ? Something sure as hell has. Either you get infected or you don't when talking purely about the unvaccinated. What has caused this change is the real relevant question, to me anyway.

Fewer lockdowns. More gatherings. Possibly fewer precautions (like masks) for some...
 
Miss.  That pertains to why you might get infected.  Not why you are going to die from it.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:22pm

 kurtster wrote:
That the death rate of the unvaccinated has basically doubled over that time is profound. Why is that ? What has changed that much ? Something sure as hell has. Either you get infected or you don't when talking purely about the unvaccinated. What has caused this change is the real relevant question, to me anyway.

Fewer lockdowns. More gatherings. Possibly fewer precautions (like masks) for some...
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 8:26pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


Who's dying?

Let's do some quick math (smart people shudder at the thought of Scott doing math, but oh well). At the peak of the pandemic, we were losing over 4000 souls a day, pre-vaccination, so
4000x365=1,460,000 annually out of 330 million =1 in 226 of us would die at that rate
But there are around 75 million children who were, at that time, not dying of covid and not eligible for vaccines anyway. So that's 255 million vax eligible people meaning the covid was killing 1 in 175 of us annually at that rate.

Pre-vaccine covid killed us at an annual rate of 1 in 175 (ballpark) at the winter peak of the pandemic

Current daily death rate 1870x365=682,550 dying in a year at the current rate. BUT about 70million are unvaccinated adults. 1 in 20 of the deaths are vaccinated (ballpark number from memory, probably fewer), so 95% of 682,550=648,420, 5%=34,100 roughly

330 total population 75 kids, 70 unvax leaves 185million vaccinated 

Post vaccine covid is killing at an annual rate of 1 in 108 among the unvaccinated and an annual rate of 1 in 5,425 among the vaccinated. (today's numbers as shown in this graph)

Corrections to my calculations welcome.

 
ScottFromWyoming wrote:

Hey there was more in my post and I wrote it all for you so go read it for Christ’s sake. Don’t just come say the same damn thing that made me write it in the first place. 
 
Ok.  Well pre vaccine, the virus was much different for starters, far less contagious than the current mutations.  Also you (and no one else for that matter) make no considerations for those who have been infected and survived among the unvaccinated in your numbers.  One could also dispute just exactly how many deaths are due solely to covid.  That has been an issue from day one. That could significantly change the pre and post vaccine rates.  Also you eliminated children in the pre vax numbers  Your numbers also presume a static unchanging death rate.

I cannot get past the NYT paywall so here is a link to the google search with a chart that reflects the daily death rate
 R_P wrote:
 
As you can see above rates vary by location as well.

With all that is above, my summary assuming that your numbers are correct is that there is something drastically different going on since the pre vax days and now.  That the death rate of the unvaccinated has basically doubled over that time is profound.  Why is that ?  What has changed that much ?  Something sure as hell has.  Either you get infected or you don't when talking purely about the unvaccinated.  What has caused this change is the real relevant question, to me anyway.

ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 7:10pm

 rhahl wrote:
 ScottFromWyoming wrote:
 rhahl wrote:
This graph represents a death rate of about 650,000/yr and climbing. If you think our vaccine-only plan is going to turn this around, I have some carbon offset credits to sell you.
 
I can see Democrats loosing 60 seats in the House and 5 in the Senate.

Who's dying?
 
Americans. Worst in the world right now. The vaccine-only plan was a bust. We might even get Trump back.
 
Hey there was more in my post and I wrote it all for you so go read it for Christ’s sake. Don’t just come say the same damn thing that made me write it in the first place. 
haresfur

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Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 10:36am

 black321 wrote:



The official policy here is more or less to start opening up at 70-80% fully vaccinated. I say more or less because there is a lot of disagreement on the details and whether it depends on the number of cases in the wild. Right now the country as a whole is at 45% fully vaccinated and 70% one dose for age 16 and over, but there are big differences between states. And the indigenous population is lagging.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 10:35am

 rhahl wrote:
(...) We might even get Trump back.

By 2024 most Republicans will have gone extinct from COVID due to the emergence of the MAGA variant in early 2023 in Florida.
rhahl

rhahl Avatar



Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 10:25am

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:
 rhahl wrote:
This graph represents a death rate of about 650,000/yr and climbing. If you think our vaccine-only plan is going to turn this around, I have some carbon offset credits to sell you.
 
I can see Democrats loosing 60 seats in the House and 5 in the Senate.

Who's dying?
 
Americans. Worst in the world right now. The vaccine-only plan was a bust. We might even get Trump back.
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:30am


ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:29am

 rhahl wrote:
This graph represents a death rate of about 650,000/yr and climbing. If you think our vaccine-only plan is going to turn this around, I have some carbon offset credits to sell you.
 
I can see Democrats loosing 60 seats in the House and 5 in the Senate.


Who's dying?

Let's do some quick math (smart people shudder at the thought of Scott doing math, but oh well). At the peak of the pandemic, we were losing over 4000 souls a day, pre-vaccination, so
4000x365=1,460,000 annually out of 330 million =1 in 226 of us would die at that rate
But there are around 75 million children who were, at that time, not dying of covid and not eligible for vaccines anyway. So that's 255 million vax eligible people meaning the covid was killing 1 in 175 of us annually at that rate.

Pre-vaccine covid killed us at an annual rate of 1 in 175 (ballpark) at the winter peak of the pandemic

Current daily death rate 1870x365=682,550 dying in a year at the current rate. BUT about 70million are unvaccinated adults. 1 in 20 of the deaths are vaccinated (ballpark number from memory, probably fewer), so 95% of 682,550=648,420, 5%=34,100 roughly

330 total population 75 kids, 70 unvax leaves 185million vaccinated 

Post vaccine covid is killing at an annual rate of 1 in 108 among the unvaccinated and an annual rate of 1 in 5,425 among the vaccinated. (today's numbers as shown in this graph)

Corrections to my calculations welcome.

rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 9:10am

 rhahl wrote:
This graph represents a death rate of about 650,000/yr and climbing. If you think our vaccine-only plan is going to turn this around, I have some carbon offset credits to sell you.
 
I can see Democrats loosing 60 seats in the House and 5 in the Senate.

So you can't say that the Right isn't willing to die for a cause or country.

The overwhelming majority of deaths are unvaccinated people, and the overwhelming majority of the unvaccinated are conservative / Republican.

It only makes sense that the right will blame Democrats for A) attempting to force everyone to get vaccinated, and then B) a high death toll that could have been 10 times less had those "proudly independent" Americans been vaccinated.

Make up your mind with the argument you support...  vaccination or death...  and then explain how you blame the Dems the 650K rate right now?

rhahl

rhahl Avatar



Posted: Sep 17, 2021 - 8:10am

This graph represents a death rate of about 650,000/yr and climbing. If you think our vaccine-only plan is going to turn this around, I have some carbon offset credits to sell you.
 
I can see Democrats loosing 60 seats in the House and 5 in the Senate.
westslope

westslope Avatar

Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Sep 16, 2021 - 10:58pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


Also: we have a lot of vaccine going unused right now that will probably expire before the end of the year, so what the hell.

Especially for the most vulnerable, many who could likely benefit from a booster shot given the time that has passed since their first shot(s). 

It would be nice to shower poor, developing countries with millions of doses, yet many are constrained by infrastructure.  More than just vaccines is required to increase vaccine availability.  

I am confident that the world's major powers will compete for hearts and minds (as well as favours like procurement contracts) by trying to out-give each other in vaccine diplomacy.  Somewhere in the background, NGOs should be helping to fill in some of the infrastructure needs.  It will happen, just slower than most would prefer.  


ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 16, 2021 - 9:50pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:

Also: we have a lot of vaccine going unused right now that will probably expire before the end of the year, so what the hell.
Manbird

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Location: Owl Creek Bridge
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 16, 2021 - 9:09pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:

Because their big heads are why...
Red_Dragon

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Posted: Sep 16, 2021 - 5:50pm

Why Fauci and the NIH backed Covid-19 vaccine boosters before the FDA and CDC
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