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R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 11:19am

 rotekz wrote:
I didn't say anything about who consumes what. Just that migrants will nearly always vote for the party that offers the most handouts.  

That has changed somewhat as well:
Historically, a majority of BAME (Black, Asian and Minority ethnic) voters - most of whom are first or second generation migrants - have voted for the Labour party.
In 2010, 68% of BAME voters supported Labour, whilst the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats received 16% and 14% of the BAME vote respectively.

However, the recent trend among this group is a move away from Labour, with 2010 support for Labour lower than that in 2005. Recent analysis from the University of Manchester suggested a further sharp decline in BAME attachment to the Labour party ahead of the 2015 general election.

There is no evidence that BAME support is shifting decisively in the direction of a different political party. Rather, many BAME voters are now as unsure about which way to vote as the rest of the electorate.
And you ended up with Tories again...
aflanigan

aflanigan Avatar

Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 11:17am

 kurtster wrote:
 
Let's not conflate human / moral rights and Karma with Constitutional rights.  Karma is not a right.  Karma is a religious value, voluntarily ascribed to by those who seek balance and goodwill such as defined by the Golden Rule and the notion of mutual respect.  Karma also dictates the notion of you made your own bed, now lie in it.  The Constitution defines rights and rules for governance within the borders of the USA, only.  While the merits of our Constitution may be worth spreading throughout the rest of the world, that effort can be seen as an act of US Imperialism.  Better we mind our own business and keep our own house in order and lead by example. 

In terms of illegal immigration, Karma would apply to those seeking entry who make a choice to knock on the front door and ask if they may come in versus those who sneak in a back window and trespass.  It is the Karma of the trespassers.  The trespassers have no respect for the home they are encroaching on.  Where is the mutual respect ?  My Karma is unaffected should I be offended by or take issue with or defend against the trespassers if I have done nothing other than cite the rules and ask that they be respected.

I realize that you do not recognize the concept of illegal immigration to the USA.  With that, it is hard to have a meaningful discussion on this topic with you and those who share your disregard for the laws of the land.  Let's be honest here.  To redefine an illegal immigrant as an undocumented worker, I'll just take it all the way for you and get it out in the open.  They are not undocumented workers, they are undocumented Democrats.  

FTR, I do believe in Karma, but I also believe in the worth of our Constitution.  The two are not mutually exclusive. 

 
As soon as you start referring to yourself as an illegal citizen (i.e. someone who has broken a law during his lifetime, as we all have), I will be happy to start referring to undocumented immigrants as "illegals".
aflanigan

aflanigan Avatar

Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 11:14am

 rotekz wrote:

I didn't say anything about who consumes what. Just that migrants will nearly always vote for the party that offers the most handouts offers to represent all Americans, including the poor, women, minorities, etc.

 
FYT
rotekz

rotekz Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 11:06am

 RichardPrins wrote:

The majority of "handouts" are actually consumed by the natives themselves, despite what the scapegoat-searching far-right may say.

 
I didn't say anything about who consumes what. Just that migrants will nearly always vote for the party that offers the most handouts. 
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 10:48am

 Red_Dragon wrote:

Facts? He don't need no stinking facts!

 

R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 10:43am

And it's a two-way street as well...
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 10:37am

 RichardPrins wrote:

The majority of "handouts" are actually consumed by the natives themselves, despite what the scapegoat-searching far-right may say.

 
Facts? He don't need no stinking facts!
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 10:34am

 rotekz wrote:
It's the same in Europe. Migrants vote for handouts so left leaning parties want open borders.
 
The majority of "handouts" are actually consumed by the natives themselves, despite what the scapegoat-searching far-right may say.
rotekz

rotekz Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 10:17am

It's the same in Europe. Migrants vote for handouts so left leaning parties want open borders. 
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 9:49am

 aflanigan wrote:
 kurtster wrote:

I deserve rights
  
Karma dictates that you may receive the rights you demand in proportion to your willingness to extend the same privileges and rights to others of your species.
 
kurtster actually wrote:

I deserve the rights granted to me, and everyone else within the borders of the US, by the US Constitution.  My remarks deal with the quote.  
  
Let's not conflate human / moral rights and Karma with Constitutional rights.  Karma is not a right.  Karma is a religious value, voluntarily ascribed to by those who seek balance and goodwill such as defined by the Golden Rule and the notion of mutual respect.  Karma also dictates the notion of you made your own bed, now lie in it.  The Constitution defines rights and rules for governance within the borders of the USA, only.  While the merits of our Constitution may be worth spreading throughout the rest of the world, that effort can be seen as an act of US Imperialism.  Better we mind our own business and keep our own house in order and lead by example. 

In terms of illegal immigration, Karma would apply to those seeking entry who make a choice to knock on the front door and ask if they may come in versus those who sneak in a back window and trespass.  It is the Karma of the trespassers.  The trespassers have no respect for the home they are encroaching on.  Where is the mutual respect ?  My Karma is unaffected should I be offended by or take issue with or defend against the trespassers if I have done nothing other than cite the rules and ask that they be respected.

I realize that you do not recognize the concept of illegal immigration to the USA.  With that, it is hard to have a meaningful discussion on this topic with you and those who share your disregard for the laws of the land.  Let's be honest here.  To redefine an illegal immigrant as an undocumented worker, I'll just take it all the way for you and get it out in the open.  They are not undocumented workers, they are undocumented Democrats.  

FTR, I do believe in Karma, but I also believe in the worth of our Constitution.  The two are not mutually exclusive. 


Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 9:08am

 aflanigan wrote:

If you say so.
EDIT: You just had to work Donald's name in there, didn't you?{#Wink}

 
Whatever The Derpald is paying this guy is well worth it. He's convinced everyone on the forum not only to support him, but to go out and badger their family and friends to do the same. What a paragon of PR.


aflanigan

aflanigan Avatar

Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 9:04am

 rotekz wrote:

Constitution TRUMPS karma.

 
If you say so.
EDIT: You just had to work Donald's name in there, didn't you?{#Wink}
rotekz

rotekz Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 9:02am

 aflanigan wrote:

Karma dictates that you may receive the rights you demand in proportion to your willingness to extend the same privileges and rights to others of your species.
 
Constitution TRUMPS karma.
aflanigan

aflanigan Avatar

Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 8:59am

 kurtster wrote:

I deserve rights
 
Karma dictates that you may receive the rights you demand in proportion to your willingness to extend the same privileges and rights to others of your species.

Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 8:57am

 rotekz wrote:


htrib.al/CCQ7sD6

"I never saw anything like that in my home town before … I don’t get it." - Joe Scarborough 


 

rotekz

rotekz Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 8:55am



htrib.al/CCQ7sD6

"I never saw anything like that in my home town before … I don’t get it." - Joe Scarborough 

rotekz

rotekz Avatar



Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 3:28am

Rejoice!  http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-01-13/trump-new-favorite-to-take-republican-nomination-betfair-says

Donald Trump is the new favorite to win the Republican presidential nomination, Betfair said, less than three weeks before Iowa caucus-goers cast the first votes of the 2016 election.

The odds on a Trump victory are 15/8, or 34 percent, putting the billionaire real-estate mogul as favourite in the market for the first time, Betfair said in an e-mailed statement in London on Wednesday. 

 
 

sirdroseph

sirdroseph Avatar

Location: Not here, I tell you wat
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 14, 2016 - 2:44am

 stunix wrote:

but empires ebb and flow like the water that seperates us.     no one talks about the elephant in the room,  population.  what rights do you deserve?

 
I certainly do, but really it is too late. Unless we roll back the industrial revolution and all that it entails we are doomed.  In other words, we are doomed.
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 13, 2016 - 5:10pm

 stunix wrote:

but empires ebb and flow like the water that seperates us.     no one talks about the elephant in the room,  population.  what rights do you deserve?

 
I deserve the rights granted to me, and everyone else within the borders of the US, by the US Constitution.  My remarks deal with the quote.  Laws and rights only exist within jurisdictions and defined borders.  Using the right of abortion for example, it cannot exist without a border to guarantee the right.  Without a system / jurisdiction to both protect and guarantee this right, it becomes transient and meaningless, subject to whim and mood of a mob ( population ?).

Our Constitution's rights do not extend past our borders.  No one has a Constitutional right to come to this country.  There is no such thing as our First Amendment anywhere else in the world for starters.  One's religion or economic plight does not guarantee one's admission to this country. There is the right of sanctuary / asylum given to those of political persecution however, different from religious persecution.  Since our rights do not extend past our borders, we have the right to say no for any reason, valid or not.  

Ultimately, if we don't respect our own borders, no one else will either.  

Yes empires come and go.  Most of them were not worth keeping looking back.   


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