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Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » COVID-19 Page: Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 191, 192, 193 ... 201, 202, 203  Next
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haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 10, 2020 - 1:30am



 gtufano wrote:
From Italy. Reputable sources (friends) working in Lombardy hospitals say me that the situation is critical. Remember that (at least in Italy) ~10% of symptomatic people requires hospitalization _to survive_ and a significant percentage of those _require_ ICU to survive. To be clear: they are not able to breathe autonomously: no hospital -> death. AND they need to stay in hospital for 4 to 8 _weeks_. This disease is not the Black Death, but definitely it's not a _simple flu_. The point is to delay propagation to avoid to fill hospitals (and ICUs). YMMV, may be we're just very unlucky (but I don't think so).

 haresfur wrote:


 Steely_D wrote:


 cc_rider wrote:




To the larger point, there is NO country with the medical resources to handle the number of COVID-19 cases expected. 

 

The reality is that there aren’t that many COVID cases that need to be seen. Fatality is related to old age, significant underlying illness, and a high d-dimer (according to a recent Lancet article). So all the other, younger, healthier folks who come down with the illness don’t need to go to the ED or any other medical facility. They need to drink fluids, take Tylenol, stay away from others, and get over it.

THERE IS NO NEED FOR GOING TO THE ED OR CLINIC; it can’t be treated.

So all this frenetic hype about the illness has been framed completely wrong: OMG we can’t get tested and I want it! The media should be thinking clearly and saying: treat it like influenza - it hurts the old and frail, and is transmissible so don’t go out in public places if you don’t want it/don’t want to pass it around. And really, that’s all. Insinuating that everyone - EVERYONE - would benefit if the government would just allow them to be tested is creating an unnecessary strain on the medical system.

Unnecessary, and it’s obstructing real health care for those who need it - as well as teaching people the wrong things about what medical care they need. Teaching them to wrongly “need” the system is just gonna sink the boat for everyone.
 
Hmm, so you don't need to treat secondary infections or to make sure that severely ill people are getting the right fever-reducing meds, cough inhibitors, and nutrition to give them the best chance of surviving?

If you look at the Johns-Hopkins website data, Italy has a death rate of about 5% while most other countries are around 1-2%. About 35% of the cases in intensive care in Italy are under 65, which is pretty high, although it doesn't necessarily mean they are the ones dying. I would guess they wouldn't be in intensive care in an overloaded system unless they were life-threatening cases.

I think there is still a lot to be learned about this disease.

 


 

Hoping for the best for your friends and your country.
gtufano

gtufano Avatar

Location: Rome, Italy
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 10, 2020 - 1:06am

From Italy. Reputable sources (friends) working in Lombardy hospitals say me that the situation is critical. Remember that (at least in Italy) ~10% of symptomatic people requires hospitalization _to survive_ and a significant percentage of those _require_ ICU to survive. To be clear: they are not able to breathe autonomously: no hospital -> death. AND they need to stay in hospital for 4 to 8 _weeks_. This disease is not the Black Death, but definitely it's not a _simple flu_. The point is to delay propagation to avoid to fill hospitals (and ICUs). YMMV, may be we're just very unlucky (but I don't think so).

 haresfur wrote:


 Steely_D wrote:


 cc_rider wrote:




To the larger point, there is NO country with the medical resources to handle the number of COVID-19 cases expected. 

 

The reality is that there aren’t that many COVID cases that need to be seen. Fatality is related to old age, significant underlying illness, and a high d-dimer (according to a recent Lancet article). So all the other, younger, healthier folks who come down with the illness don’t need to go to the ED or any other medical facility. They need to drink fluids, take Tylenol, stay away from others, and get over it.

THERE IS NO NEED FOR GOING TO THE ED OR CLINIC; it can’t be treated.

So all this frenetic hype about the illness has been framed completely wrong: OMG we can’t get tested and I want it! The media should be thinking clearly and saying: treat it like influenza - it hurts the old and frail, and is transmissible so don’t go out in public places if you don’t want it/don’t want to pass it around. And really, that’s all. Insinuating that everyone - EVERYONE - would benefit if the government would just allow them to be tested is creating an unnecessary strain on the medical system.

Unnecessary, and it’s obstructing real health care for those who need it - as well as teaching people the wrong things about what medical care they need. Teaching them to wrongly “need” the system is just gonna sink the boat for everyone.
 
Hmm, so you don't need to treat secondary infections or to make sure that severely ill people are getting the right fever-reducing meds, cough inhibitors, and nutrition to give them the best chance of surviving?

If you look at the Johns-Hopkins website data, Italy has a death rate of about 5% while most other countries are around 1-2%. About 35% of the cases in intensive care in Italy are under 65, which is pretty high, although it doesn't necessarily mean they are the ones dying. I would guess they wouldn't be in intensive care in an overloaded system unless they were life-threatening cases.

I think there is still a lot to be learned about this disease.

 


haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 10, 2020 - 12:13am



 Steely_D wrote:


 cc_rider wrote:




To the larger point, there is NO country with the medical resources to handle the number of COVID-19 cases expected. 

 

The reality is that there aren’t that many COVID cases that need to be seen. Fatality is related to old age, significant underlying illness, and a high d-dimer (according to a recent Lancet article). So all the other, younger, healthier folks who come down with the illness don’t need to go to the ED or any other medical facility. They need to drink fluids, take Tylenol, stay away from others, and get over it.

THERE IS NO NEED FOR GOING TO THE ED OR CLINIC; it can’t be treated.

So all this frenetic hype about the illness has been framed completely wrong: OMG we can’t get tested and I want it! The media should be thinking clearly and saying: treat it like influenza - it hurts the old and frail, and is transmissible so don’t go out in public places if you don’t want it/don’t want to pass it around. And really, that’s all. Insinuating that everyone - EVERYONE - would benefit if the government would just allow them to be tested is creating an unnecessary strain on the medical system.

Unnecessary, and it’s obstructing real health care for those who need it - as well as teaching people the wrong things about what medical care they need. Teaching them to wrongly “need” the system is just gonna sink the boat for everyone.
 
Hmm, so you don't need to treat secondary infections or to make sure that severely ill people are getting the right fever-reducing meds, cough inhibitors, and nutrition to give them the best chance of surviving?

If you look at the Johns-Hopkins website data, Italy has a death rate of about 5% while most other countries are around 1-2%. About 35% of the cases in intensive care in Italy are under 65, which is pretty high, although it doesn't necessarily mean they are the ones dying. I would guess they wouldn't be in intensive care in an overloaded system unless they were life-threatening cases.

I think there is still a lot to be learned about this disease.

Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 11:44pm



 cc_rider wrote:




To the larger point, there is NO country with the medical resources to handle the number of COVID-19 cases expected. 

 

The reality is that there aren’t that many COVID cases that need to be seen. Fatality is related to old age, significant underlying illness, and a high d-dimer (according to a recent Lancet article). So all the other, younger, healthier folks who come down with the illness don’t need to go to the ED or any other medical facility. They need to drink fluids, take Tylenol, stay away from others, and get over it.

THERE IS NO NEED FOR GOING TO THE ED OR CLINIC; it can’t be treated.

So all this frenetic hype about the illness has been framed completely wrong: OMG we can’t get tested and I want it! The media should be thinking clearly and saying: treat it like influenza - it hurts the old and frail, and is transmissible so don’t go out in public places if you don’t want it/don’t want to pass it around. And really, that’s all. Insinuating that everyone - EVERYONE - would benefit if the government would just allow them to be tested is creating an unnecessary strain on the medical system.

Unnecessary, and it’s obstructing real health care for those who need it - as well as teaching people the wrong things about what medical care they need. Teaching them to wrongly “need” the system is just gonna sink the boat for everyone.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 6:27pm

...expect a circus.
Quarantined at home now, U.S. scientist describes his visit to China’s hot zone


R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 5:05pm

Gaetz becomes fourth GOP congressman to self-quarantine after possible coronavirus exposure at CPAC
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 4:27pm

US PERCENT WITHOUT HEALTH INSURANCE BY CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT

I'm curious to see a similar map representing COVID-19 deaths after the pandemic has passed.
haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 4:23pm

I was looking at the Johns-Hopkins website and wonder why the death rate in Italy is about 5% but more like 1-2% in the rest of the world.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 3:30pm

 cc_rider wrote:
To the larger point, there is NO country with the medical resources to handle the number of COVID-19 cases expected.

Definitely. Any healthcare system will staff and resource for baseline population needs (with or without additional extra/private options). An epidemic or pandemic is not part of that.
cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 3:16pm



 R_P wrote:
Overheard one (COVID) screener at the McGill Dental Faculty say it's time flights from the US are blocked. Having no public healthcare and all that...
 
Makes a good point, actually.

If you're sick, but cannot afford to pay for treatment, you go to the emergency room, right? Which everyone knows is the best place to get prompt care. Sure, you'll have to wait until they clear the crash victims, gunshot/stabbing victims, ODs, and REALLY sick COVID-19 patients, but you'll be first on the list after them.

If you're sick, but do not have 'papers', you don't even go to the emergency room, for fear of being detained (or worse).

To the larger point, there is NO country with the medical resources to handle the number of COVID-19 cases expected. By 10X or more. In China, patients with serious treatable conditions have died, because there are not enough resources to care for COVID-19 patients AND the normal number of critical patients. Dialysis, chemo, blood tests, etc. etc. are all set aside in favor of COVID-19 management.

It's going to get a lot worse before it gets better.
c.

R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 3:08pm

 Isabeau wrote:
Trump Can't Bluff his way through this crisis   

Donald Trump is revealing how “deeply unsuited he is to deal with a genuine crisis that he can’t bluff his way through,” according to an editorial published Sunday in the Washington Examiner, a conservative political news site and weekly magazine that often has the president’s back.
This time, the Examiner had a serious problem with the president’s deceitful approach to the coronavirus threat."It’s one thing for Trump to insist he had a ‘perfect’ phone call and have all his Republican minions fall in line. It’s another thing to downplay a growing epidemic as more and more Americans get sick,” wrote the Examiner’s executive editor Philip Klein.
 
The librul NYT had a similar piece:
For a president who lives in the moment, rarely planning too far ahead, the coronavirus has proved to be a leadership challenge he was not prepared for either. The outbreak that has rattled the nation does not respond to Mr. Trump’s favorite instruments of power: It cannot be cowed by Twitter posts, it cannot be shot down by drones, it cannot be overcome by party solidarity, it cannot be overpowered by campaign rally chants.

Mr. Trump, who is at his strongest politically when he has a human enemy to attack, has seemed less certain of how to take on an invisible killer. The role of calming natural leader is not one that has come easily as he struggles to find the balance between public reassurance and Panglossian dismissiveness. He has predicted that the virus will “miraculously” disappear on its own with warmer weather, suggested a vaccine will be available soon and insisted anyone who wants to be tested can be — all overstated or inaccurate.
And Variety: Trump, Germaphobe in Chief, Struggles to Control the Covid-19 Story
Isabeau

Isabeau Avatar

Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 2:56pm

Trump Can't Bluff his way through this crisis   

Donald Trump is revealing how “deeply unsuited he is to deal with a genuine crisis that he can’t bluff his way through,” according to an editorial published Sunday in the Washington Examiner, a conservative political news site and weekly magazine that often has the president’s back.
This time, the Examiner had a serious problem with the president’s deceitful approach to the coronavirus threat.

"It’s one thing for Trump to insist he had a ‘perfect’ phone call and have all his Republican minions fall in line. It’s another thing to downplay a growing epidemic as more and more Americans get sick,” wrote the Examiner’s executive editor Philip Klein.


R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 2:49pm

Overheard one (COVID) screener at the McGill Dental Faculty say it's time flights from the US are blocked. Having no public healthcare and all that...
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 10:44am

 westslope wrote:


 black321 wrote:


 westslope wrote:


  
Exercise is MUCH more important than diet.  
 

Perhaps? but diet's still IMPORTANT
 
Far less important than most North Americans like to think.

Recall the new buzz phrase:  "Sitting is the new tobacco."

Besides if one is truly physically active, there many types of food that one will want to avoid.

 
I guess that you never heard the expression that you are what you eat ?
westslope

westslope Avatar

Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 10:39am

It is rather curious that the COVID-19 virus hits at the same time the US adult obesity rates attains 40% and is forecast to hit 50% in the near future.

God wanted to reward Americans for being 'exceptional' and pursuing the cheap energy entitlement at any cost.   Mission accomplished.  
westslope

westslope Avatar

Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 10:34am



 black321 wrote:


 westslope wrote:


  
Exercise is MUCH more important than diet.  


 

Perhaps? but diet's still IMPORTANT
 
Far less important than most North Americans like to think.

Recall the new buzz phrase:  "Sitting is the new tobacco."

Besides if one is truly physically active, there many types of food that one will want to avoid.

Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 10:28am



 cc_rider wrote:

Well carp. That sucks, but let's hope it's just a precautionary measure. It makes sense to limit medically frail folks' exposure, it doesn't seem like an over-reaction.
Regardless, not being able to see your Dad adds worry to everyone. Can he Skype, text, email, send smoke signals?*

*thinly-veiled Oklahoma joke

Best wishes,
c.

 
It's precautionary - no suspected cases. Sadly, communicating with him at this point must be done face to face, and even then it's minimal.

Thanks

cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 10:24am



 Red_Dragon wrote:
The nursing home were my father lives is now closed to visitors until further notice.
 
Well carp. That sucks, but let's hope it's just a precautionary measure. It makes sense to limit medically frail folks' exposure, it doesn't seem like an over-reaction.
Regardless, not being able to see your Dad adds worry to everyone. Can he Skype, text, email, send smoke signals?*

*thinly-veiled Oklahoma joke

Best wishes,
c.

Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 10:14am

The nursing home were my father lives is now closed to visitors until further notice.
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 9, 2020 - 9:55am

 black321 wrote:
so if you missed buying stock in the hand wash/sanitizer companies...the next tip is hand moisturizer....lots of dry hands out there from all that washing. 
 
As an optician (and also having been in the food business for over 10 years in my twenties), I am always washing my hands because of my contact with people and their glasses.  My hands are cracked as they usually are in the winter from all of the hand washing.  With the threat of infection, I have consciously beefed up my use of moisturizer for my hands to heal the cracks which will allow infections another way to enter the body.

My lament based upon the experience of my current profession (now over 25 years) is that most people think that (or act like) hygiene is a type of denim clothing ... 
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