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ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 9, 2017 - 2:35am

 Lazy8 wrote:
Why the Russia Story Is a Minefield for Democrats and the Media

Hypothesize for a moment that the "scandal" here is real, but in a limited sense: Trump's surrogates have not colluded with Russians, but have had “contacts,” and recognize their political liability, and lie about them. Investigators then leak the true details of these contacts, leaving the wild speculations to the media and the Internet. Trump is enough of a pig and a menace that it's easy to imagine doing this and not feeling terribly sorry that your leaks have been over-interpreted.

If that's the case, there are big dangers for the press. If we engage in Times-style gilding of every lily the leakers throw our way, and in doing so build up a fever of expectations for a bombshell reveal, but there turns out to be no conspiracy – Trump will be pre-inoculated against all criticism for the foreseeable future.



 
It's almost as if Trump has already reasoned this out. I know I don't often have the foresight to see what he's doing, but I sure have the hindsight... he's inoculated himself in exactly this way dozens of times in the past couple of years. People who insist that he's stupid... are who's to blame for him even having the job, but are also guaranteeing 8 years. 
Lazy8

Lazy8 Avatar

Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 8, 2017 - 9:53pm

Why the Russia Story Is a Minefield for Democrats and the Media

Hypothesize for a moment that the "scandal" here is real, but in a limited sense: Trump's surrogates have not colluded with Russians, but have had “contacts,” and recognize their political liability, and lie about them. Investigators then leak the true details of these contacts, leaving the wild speculations to the media and the Internet. Trump is enough of a pig and a menace that it's easy to imagine doing this and not feeling terribly sorry that your leaks have been over-interpreted.

If that's the case, there are big dangers for the press. If we engage in Times-style gilding of every lily the leakers throw our way, and in doing so build up a fever of expectations for a bombshell reveal, but there turns out to be no conspiracy – Trump will be pre-inoculated against all criticism for the foreseeable future.


Lazy8

Lazy8 Avatar

Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 8, 2017 - 12:18pm

 aflanigan wrote:
The implied connection, as your "debunking" pointed out, could not be proven or disproven. 

The FISA wiretap request that got approved was specifically for the purpose of looking at the communications between the two servers the article was based on. So I beg to differ, this directly bears on Trump's bellyaching over Obama putting a "tapp" on him. Trump got his accusation from Mark Levin (see the video miamizsun posted in Republican Party).

1. Have you seen the FISA wiretap request? I haven't. I've read about it, but as far as I know its very existence is classified and has not been acknowledged by anyone who has legal authority to know about it.

2. Trump is the President. Pretty sure he could find out from one of his subordinates whether the warrant was issued and with what justification. He could also declassify the order so we could all read it without being threatened with prosecution by Obama's Justice Dept. Or, well, whichever.

3. Trump (via his spokesfolk) has called for a Congressional investigation into this. Let's take him up on it. This would give his opponents an opportunity to dig up any connections to the Russians as well as exposing the abusive surveillance practices (that were so necessary for national security during the last administration) in place.
aflanigan

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Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 8, 2017 - 10:02am

 Lazy8 wrote:
 aflanigan wrote:
You're missing the point. Trump campaign insisted they had nothing to do with the server in question. Now he's accusing Obama of spying on him based on the narrowly targeted FISA warrant request designed to look into this particular communication link between servers. Why would Trump get his panties all in a twist if he has no relation to this particular server? What is he trying to hide?

Um...what point does a bogus news story make, again?

I have no idea whether the Trump campaign used the server in question and I don't care. The connection implied by the article you linked to is fake. This has nothing to do with a FISA wiretap.

 
The implied connection, as your "debunking" pointed out, could not be proven or disproven. 

The FISA wiretap request that got approved was specifically for the purpose of looking at the communications between the two servers the article was based on. So I beg to differ, this directly bears on Trump's bellyaching over Obama putting a "tapp" on him. Trump got his accusation from Mark Levin (see the video miamizsun posted in Republican Party).
Lazy8

Lazy8 Avatar

Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 8, 2017 - 9:38am

 aflanigan wrote:
You're missing the point. Trump campaign insisted they had nothing to do with the server in question. Now he's accusing Obama of spying on him based on the narrowly targeted FISA warrant request designed to look into this particular communication link between servers. Why would Trump get his panties all in a twist if he has no relation to this particular server? What is he trying to hide?

Um...what point does a bogus news story make, again?

I have no idea whether the Trump campaign used the server in question and I don't care. The connection implied by the article you linked to is fake. This has nothing to do with a FISA wiretap.
aflanigan

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Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 8, 2017 - 9:20am

 Lazy8 wrote:
 aflanigan wrote:
Definitive? Definitely not comprehensive. 

Remember this? 

Sure. I also remember the debunking. You need to get out of your bubble more.

 
You're missing the point. Trump campaign insisted they had nothing to do with the server in question. Now he's accusing Obama of spying on him based on the narrowly targeted FISA warrant request designed to look into this particular communication link between servers. Why would Trump get his panties all in a twist if he has no relation to this particular server? What is he trying to hide?

NoEnzLefttoSplit

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Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 10:47pm

 R_P wrote: 
... by promoting a xenophobic conspiracy theory in the cause of removing a xenophobic conspiracy theorist from office..
that is indeed a good line. She's right. We should focus on what Trump does. 
Lazy8

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Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 3:12pm

 aflanigan wrote:
Definitive? Definitely not comprehensive. 

Remember this? 

Sure. I also remember the debunking. You need to get out of your bubble more.
steeler

steeler Avatar

Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth


Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 3:01pm

 kurtster wrote:

Pretty much agree with Greenwald on this and Gessen's assessment but not her conclusions about what she sees as Trump's ultimate plan.  I read her article in full that was referenced by Greenwald.

Yes, all this distraction will allow terrible Bills to get put through cuz no one is paying attention, such as this crap the GOP is trying to call a fix to Obamacare.  The other side of the establishment, the GOP, likes this cuz it also distracts Trump from his own focus that would restrain the GOP from being what it is, the other side of the same coin. 

 

 
Trump is free to put up his own bill (I assume he would be able to get a congressman to introduce it) — assuming he even has a plan. At the time of his inauguration, he was saying it was all but done, just dotting the "i's" and crossing the "t's."  A great plan that would cover everyone.  

 

 




aflanigan

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Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 2:59pm

 kurtster wrote:

Pretty much agree with Greenwald on this and Gessen's assessment but not her conclusions about what she sees as Trump's ultimate plan.  I read her article in full that was referenced by Greenwald.

Yes, all this distraction will allow terrible Bills to get put through cuz no one is paying attention, such as this crap the GOP is trying to call a fix to Obamacare.  The other side of the establishment, the GOP, likes this cuz it also distracts Trump from his own focus that would restrain the GOP from being what it is, the other side of the same coin. 

 

 
IIRC prescient voters like you went for Trump precisely for this reason: His easy distractability and manipulability would allow whichever party controlled Congress to basically continue the status quo and screw the poor and middle class more thoroughly.

Clever, indeed. 
kurtster

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Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 2:51pm

 R_P wrote: 
Pretty much agree with Greenwald on this and Gessen's assessment but not her conclusions about what she sees as Trump's ultimate plan.  I read her article in full that was referenced by Greenwald.

Yes, all this distraction will allow terrible Bills to get put through cuz no one is paying attention, such as this crap the GOP is trying to call a fix to Obamacare.  The other side of the establishment, the GOP, likes this cuz it also distracts Trump from his own focus that would restrain the GOP from being what it is, the other side of the same coin. 

 


aflanigan

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Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 2:43pm

 Red_Dragon wrote: 
Definitive? Definitely not comprehensive. 

Remember this? 
Red_Dragon

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Location: Dumbf*ckistan


Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 1:04pm

The definitive Trump-Russia timeline of events
R_P

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Posted: Mar 7, 2017 - 12:47pm

Leading Putin Critic Warns of Xenophobic Conspiracy Theories Drowning U.S. Discourse and Helping Trump (Greenwald)
ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 2, 2017 - 9:17pm

 aflanigan wrote:

Just ordered mine, and got a set of prosthetic finger extenders as an "add on" item shipped for free.

| 

 
Thanks! 
aflanigan

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Location: At Sea
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 2, 2017 - 1:29pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:
***THIS POST IS SPAM***

I neglected to post here when this shirt got accepted onto Amazon.com. Now you can get it with free shipping if you have Prime!
 
 
 
Oh, and get it now before the price goes up! Seriously. I just raised the price a couple of bucks; it'll take a while for that to percolate thru the system... edit: Too late!

 
Just ordered mine, and got a set of prosthetic finger extenders as an "add on" item shipped for free.

| 
ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Mar 2, 2017 - 9:23am

***THIS POST IS SPAM***

I neglected to post here when this shirt got accepted onto Amazon.com. Now you can get it with free shipping if you have Prime!
 
 
 
Oh, and get it now before the price goes up! Seriously. I just raised the price a couple of bucks; it'll take a while for that to percolate thru the system... edit: Too late!


Skydog

Skydog Avatar



Posted: Mar 2, 2017 - 7:42am

 Red_Dragon wrote: 
okay, lets get the other side of the story, only TASS knows for sure {#Rolleyes}
http://tass.com/politics/933662
Red_Dragon

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Location: Dumbf*ckistan


Posted: Mar 1, 2017 - 6:31pm

Sessions spoke twice with Russian ambassador during Trump’s presidential campaign, Justice officials say
LowPhreak

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Location: Divided Corporate States of Neo-Feudal Murikka, Inc.
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 22, 2017 - 3:56pm

 kurtster wrote:
...You have to invest a lot of time in order to glean the small kernels of real information by learning your sources and how to read them over time.  Sound bites will never allow that to happen.

...
The truth will never be dumped in anyone's lap tied with a bow on it.  It must be pursued and earned.
 
Yes and to that end, here's a new article over at The Intercept about billionaire Peter Thiel and Palantir. TI regularly has similar, very revealing and damning articles, such as one a few months ago on Erik Prince and his company Academi (formerly named XE Services or Blackwater). Too many great articles to list really.

I'd also recommend people check YouTube and the web for people like William Binney, J. Kirk Wiebe and Tom Drake, all former NSA officials. Listen to their stories.

This is the stuff that you won't see on the MSM. Because it's too frightening and too revealing of the state the U.S. is in.

And the above only covers the areas of illegal, unconstitutional spying/surveillance, weapons running and attempted coups.

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