Lazy8 wrote: 
Ever has it been so...

RichardPrins wrote:
There aren't just two sides. The assumption that there are drives a lot of these alliances—that The Good Guys need to be as ruthless as the Enemy or the bad guys will win. We end up with a world dominated by Bad Guys and Slightly Less Bad Guys.

 Lazy8 wrote: 
If one side does it (Pinochet, South African Apartheid regime, Stroessner, Saddam, Mubarak, The Shah, House of Saud, etc., etc.), then surely it's no surprise that the other will too?

RichardPrins wrote:
Mandela had to rely on a lot of unsavory characters (Qaddafi, Hafez al-Assad, and Robert Mugabe, among others) on his way to power. War makes for odd bedfellows. Roosevelt and Churchill were teamed up with Stalin (once he changed teams) to fight WW2, after all.

 kurtster wrote: 
 That episode of history actually got some coverage not too long ago when former 'terrorist' Nelson Mandela died...

In 1991, Nelson Mandela traveled to Cuba to thank Fidel Castro and the Cuban people for supporting the fight against apartheid and colonialism in southern Africa. "The decisive defeat of the aggressive apartheid forces (in Angola) destroyed the myth of the invincibility of the white oppressor," Mandela said. "The defeat of the apartheid army served as an inspiration to the struggling people of South Africa." Below are excerpts from the speech:
 
NELSON MANDELA: We have come here today recognizing our great debt to the Cuban people. What other country has such a history of selfless behavior as Cuba has shown for the people of Africa? How many countries benefit from Cuban health care professionals and educators? How many of these volunteers are now in Africa? What country has ever needed help from Cuba and has not received it? How many countries threatened by imperialism or fighting for their freedom have been able to count on the support of Cuba?

I was still in prison when I first heard of the massive help which the Cuban international forces were giving to the people of Angola. The help was of such a scale that it was difficult for us to believe it, when the Angolans were under attack by the combined forces of South Africa, the FALA who were financed by the CIA, mercenaries, UNITA, and Zaire in 1975. (...)

 RichardPrins wrote: 
Why don't you ask the Angolan's what they think of Cuban's.  Or perhaps you're too young to remember the Cuban 'help' in the gruesome bloody civil war in Angola and that general region of Africa.  There is nothing stopping the Cuban's from doing in Venezuela what they did in Angola.  Raul Castro was running the show in Angola back then.  Let us not forget Cuba's enormous dependence on Venezuelan oil.  Yeah, even your heroes have a need for oil, too.  It is always about oil in the end, eh ?

Its probably not a stretch to say that Ché is a personal hero of your's ?

 Mugro wrote:
Are you still on the clock or just having fun?
(not that those are necessarily mutually exclusive!)

I guess you forgot that Cubans aren't nearly as scary to people outside the US of A. As you may know, lots of people over here go to Cuba on holidays.
Now excuse me, while I have some homework and zombies to tend to in real life...

I might just check back later to see what the next set of US State Dept. talking points will be...

Richard, once again I applaud your googling prowess. You are quite an internet scholar. However, have you ever been to Venezuela? Do you know personally how many Cubans are here or not here? Perhaps not. I am here, and I can tell you from personal first hand observation that there are many. It is not some sort of scare tactic. It is a matter of fact. However, Cubans are no longer as welcome here as they once were, as evidenced by this fun video taken a few days ago at the arrival terminal at the Caracas airport. I found this little bit on twitter, so it doesn't have any connection to wikileaks or confidential material. In case you don't speak Spanish, the people gathered there (by chance) shouted "A fuera!!" ("Leave!") at the Cubans as they arrived on a plane from..... you guessed it! Cuba! Not sure what these particular Cubans were doing here, but it is rumored that Cuban troops have been landing here throughout the week in order to aid in the pacification of the citizenry. Love the touch of the Che Guevara teeshirts. Looks kind of Berkley to me....

Cubans Unwelcome in Caracas
 RichardPrins wrote:

Which is the face of fascism in Venezuela today?

Wikileaks in Venezuela: Espionage, Propaganda, and Disinformation | venezuelanalysis.com (Dec 2010)

(...) The Embassy cables on Venezuela don't just reveal a distortion of Venezuela's reality, which is an attempt to portray the Chavez administration in a negative light, they also provide insight into who the US government sources are and how US diplomats operate as spies in the country.

One document, a scathing analysis of the alleged Cuban presence in Venezuela's intelligence services and a host of other government institutions, would at first glance be alarming. The cable, cynically titled "Cuba/Venezuela Axis of Mischief: The View from Caracas", was written by notorious former Ambassador William Brownfield in January 2006, and claims Cubans have penetrated almost every aspect of Venezuela's government, culture and economy. It's reminiscent of Cold War era fear-mongering about the "communist expansion" and "red scare" in the hemisphere. This time, however, instead of the Russians, it's the "Cubans are coming...they are everywhere". Be alarmed, be very alarmed. (...)

In 2008, the US Embassy in Caracas decided it was time to employ the heavy services of the Pentagon's psychological operations team to bombard Venezuelans with pro-US propaganda, to counter, what an Embassy cable claimed in March 2008, "Chavez's anti-americanism".

"Embassy Caracas requests DOD (Department of Defense) support in the execution of its strategic communications plan. The goal for this program is to influence the information environment within Venezuela...DOD support would greatly enhance existing Embassy Public Diplomacy and pro-democracy activities".

Infuencing the "information environment" in Venezuela with Pentagon support is clearly an outright violation of Venezuela's sovereignty, which appears to be a common denominator in most of the Embassy cables published so far on Venezuela. The State Department's 2011 budget includes a special multimillion-dollar fund for a "30-minute, 5-day a week program in Spanish in Venezuela" and the Pentagon's includes a new program for "psychological operations" in the Southern Command (Latin America).

Some of the information in the cables can be verified by fact and corroborating evidence, while other data remains in the realm of rumors and bogus sources. What is clear is the that the documents reaffirm the increasing US aggression against Venezuela and its hostile foreign policy against the Chavez administration, including a willingness to use unsubstantiated rumors to make dangerous accusations.

The face of facism?

 RichardPrins wrote: 
I guess this is similar to Reuters repeatedly calling the opposition "hardline" and the number of protesters "small."

Maduro is very much an autocratic ruler:
 
 

I suppose these are "hardline opposition fascists" dressed up as Venezuelan Guardia Nacional firing into a crowd? This happened yesterday, in Caracas. The people on the right were peaceful protesters holding a demonstration. Without weapons. The dudes on the left, that's the government. The ones with the guns. I will spare you the pictures of all the students who were beaten, shot and otherwise abused by their own government. You can go to twitter for that. The government sympathizers really had to bend, twist and recreate the truth to make the argument that it was a shadowy fascist group that started the violence, particularly when a known member of an international terrorist group and friend of the government was one of those who were killed. What was he doing there, anyway? Defending the revolution, of course. With violence. Go read up on the "collectivo" that "Juancho" was a local leader for: Tupamaros

Noam Chomsky, Scholars Ask NY Times Public Editor to Investigate Bias on Honduras and Venezuela | North American Congress on Latin America (May 2013)

 RichardPrins wrote: 
Laughable "analysis."

Coups, Media and Stalemates: What Violent Protests Mean for Venezuela | venezuelanalysis.com

#1: An Opposition Coup Against The Opposition Ryan Mallett-Outtrim

#2: What the Media Said, and Didn’t Say Ewan Robertson

#3: A Complex Psychological War, and What This Means for the Bolivarian Revolution Tamara Pearson