It was an argument about your use of 'murder'. It has a definition that most people understand. It does not make the point that abortion is OK, because it's legal. Abortion is killing, not murder.If abortion would be illegal, it would be considered murder.
To address your red herring/straw person: You presume incorrectly.
Because: I don't believe in retributivism (an eye for an eye, a rape for a rape, etc.), there are too many errors made in the justice system, and I believe the state should not be involved in killing citizens without consent. There are more reasons.
Some laws are good, some are bad. And there are arguments to be made why they may be good or bad.
Gotcha, we are on the same page.I guess those semantics came into play after all!
Since it is not unlawful, I am to presume you feel the same way about capital punishment?
It was an argument about your use of 'murder'. It has a definition that most people understand. It does not make the point that abortion is OK, because it's legal. Abortion is killing, not murder. If abortion would be illegal, it would be considered murder.
To address your red herring/straw person: You presume incorrectly.
Because: I don't believe in retributivism (an eye for an eye, a rape for a rape, etc.), there are too many errors made in the justice system, and I believe the state should not be involved in killing citizens without consent. There are more reasons.
Some laws are good, some are bad. And there are arguments to be made why they may be good or bad.
Anyone with any doubts about what abortion is should google it and turn your image filter off.
Yep yep, I myself am pro choice but have no illusions on what I am supporting. It is indeed murder and there are no linguistics or semantics that you can come up with that will change that. Sadly, I just think that there are situations where it is better than the alternative and the choice should not be taken away.
Location: i believe, i believe, it's silly, but I believe Gender:
Posted:
Jan 4, 2016 - 9:33am
Anyone who has any doubts about what it is to grow up as an unwanted/poor child should work in my job for one day, and see whether you support a woman's right to choose.
How seemingly difficult it is for people to see Bill Cosby for what he is or trying to bring other reasons (race) as throwing doubt on the situation after all of these accusers. And people wonder why women don't always come forward or do so belatedly. Yes, there is a war on women indeed.
Notice how we are inundated with E.D. Medicine ads, but not one Condom ad during Prime Time television? The subliminal message to American men, young and old, is quite clear: "Guys, be ready for the Moment, but leave all that STD and Pregnancy Prevention to that other person."
This country has the strangest relationship with sex. Encourage Men to get it on, but don't equally encourage Responsibility. The Prudes insist Condom ads will encourage young men to have sex. Nothing needs to encourage young men to have sex, but something sure is needed to encourage them to be RESPONSIBLE when having sex. Oh no, we can't have that, we Americans prefer to demonize Women for the unpleasant side effects of sex.
Like Yoko Ono once said "Woman is nigger of the world."
How seemingly difficult it is for people to see Bill Cosby for what he is or trying to bring other reasons (race) as throwing doubt on the situation after all of these accusers. And people wonder why women don't always come forward or do so belatedly. Yes, there is a war on women indeed.
A fire Wednesday night at a Planned Parenthood facility in Thousand Oaks was determined to be arson, authorities said.
Ventura County sheriff’s Capt. John Reilly said Thursday someone likely used a rock to shatter a window at the Planned Parenthood facility in the 1200 block of West Hillcrest Drive, then threw gasoline inside the office and ignited it.
The attack comes more than six weeks after the office was vandalized, he said. Details about the vandalism were not immediately available, but Reilly said it was minor. (...)
According to Inna Shevchenko, a spokeswoman for the feminist protest group, two fundamentalist preachers were discussing the question of “whether wives should be beaten or not” when the activists, aged 25 and 31, ripped off their Arab-style cloaks and jumped on to the stage on Saturday evening. One had the slogan “No one subjugates me” inked across her torso. The other bore the words “I am my own prophet.”
An early-morning fire at Planned Parenthood in Pullman Friday was arson, according to the Pullman Fire Department and the Inland Northwest Joint Terrorism Task Force.
The fire, which started around 3:30 a.m., caused significant damage that may keep the health center closed for a month or more, Planned Parenthood spokeswoman Tanya Riordan said.
Karl Eastlund, CEO of Planned Parenthood of Greater Washington and North Idaho, said in a statement, “This is an appalling act of violence towards Planned Parenthood, but unfortunately a predictable ripple effect from the false and incendiary attacks that fuel violence from extremists.”
FBI Special Agent Frank Harrill said federal agencies were involved because of the history of domestic terrorists targeting healthcare providers offering abortion services.
In 1996, a Planned Parenthood clinic in Spokane Valley was bombed. Four men were convicted in the blast. (...)
Prochoice does not mean that one endorses abortion. In my case (as I have often stated and quite a few more as I know), it means that an abortion is solely between the woman and her doctor. No government, no father, just the woman and her doctor. It is their business alone.
Blatant corruption and criminal behaviour has been identified.
That is enough to stop things right there all by itself. You shoot the messenger and ignore the message. Its what you do so well.
I suppose that you regard the overall benefits worth the corruption and criminal activity. The ends justify the means an all ...
That sounds more like a right to privacy. What choice is made there? (I smell another pernicious word re-definition game à la "baby")
I happen to think women's rights (or gay rights or rights for minorities) are important. Your positions, as demonstrated so frequently in this forum, happen to be opposed to that which leaves you with nothing but crying about political correctness and petty shenanigans.
Corruption and criminal behaviour. That's of course according to the false assertions and dishonesty by an anti-abortion shell organization with an Orwellian name to boot. Not that they'd have an agenda or anything. No sir!
But as always the gullible reactionaries are eager to lap it up. If only they could still live in the 50s when everyone knew their rightful place and certain people didn't get all uppity. Pining with nostalgia, and eager to urge the common folk, as some famous fascists in the past, to make the country great and wholesome again!
Ladies, get those uteri running and bear us some more patriots!
People commonly talk about selling bridges (as in BS), but the F-35 money pit analogy is more apt nowadays. Probably costs a whole lot more too. You know. Money.
Add some of the usual anti-science flavour and we're back to the usual Fox/Republican reactionary rhetoric.
I'll come back to you when you know how to correctly use babies vs. fetuses/embryos and without being dishonest/manipulative (yeah right, that'd be the day). It's just about the money (not about stirring up emotions with graphic descriptions and false claims to attempt to limit access to abortion and contraception). Riiiiiiight.
Funny. Don't people like you want to get rid of the ACA as well?
Until then keep on supporting your anti-abortion fundie extremist friends, despite "being pro-choice". However, when it quacks, walks, and talks like a fundie...
Prochoice does not mean that one endorses abortion. In my case (as I have often stated and quite a few more as I know), it means that an abortion is solely between the woman and her doctor. No government, no father, just the woman and her doctor. It is their business alone.
Blatant corruption and criminal behaviour has been identified.
That is enough to stop things right there all by itself. You shoot the messenger and ignore the message. Its what you do so well.
I suppose that you regard the overall benefits worth the corruption and criminal activity. The ends justify the means an all ...
This particular vote you highlighted revolves entirely around the fact that it has been revealed that there is illegal trafficking in human body parts, for profit, under the guise of 'research'. Since there will be no investigation by the DOJ for political reasons, Congress did what it is allowed to do. It failed to defund it this time. Had this most recent video I posted been available before the vote, I bet the result would have been different.
I doubt that you watched the video. But if you had, you would have seen a mass of body parts dumped out in a tray being poked around and discussed. I clearly saw a set of tiny lungs, an eye, a little arm with a reasonably developed hand as well as a leg of this particular aborted human being discussed like it was ingredients for a stir fry.
I stayed entirely on topic, while you spun in every other direction, ending up with fighter jets. PP, while having done some good in the beginning of its existence, despite being founded by a known eugenicist, has outlived its usefulness and twisted its mission to the point where it views pregnant women as breeders of human body parts for profit. Time for it to go, especially since the ACA has made it a redundant and unnecessary business.
People commonly talk about selling bridges (as in BS), but the F-35 money pit analogy is more apt nowadays. Probably costs a whole lot more too. You know. Money.
Add some of the usual anti-science flavour and we're back to the usual Fox/Republican reactionary rhetoric.
I'll come back to you when you know how to correctly use babies vs. fetuses/embryos and without being dishonest/manipulative (yeah right, that'd be the day). It's just about the money (not about stirring up emotions with graphic descriptions and false claims to attempt to limit access to abortion and contraception). Riiiiiiight.
Funny. Don't people like you want to get rid of the ACA as well?
Until then keep on supporting your anti-abortion fundie extremist friends, despite "being pro-choice". However, when it quacks, walks, and talks like a fundie...
The only thing I pointed out was your blatantly dishonest use of the term 'baby', as extremists are wont to do. Not a peep about whether or not fetuses/embryos get donated to research (which is think both legal and ethically fine). Now profiting of chopped up babies, infants, or children without consent would strike me as illegal. But that doesn't seem relevant, just red meat, so to speak, to anger and take away funding so some people will end up having to resort to unsafe back alley abortions once again.
Oh, and since you're once again defending extremists, this time under the guise of 'spending' (do you have a F-35 for sale? I'll buy that off of you too):
Its entirely relevant. You picked this thread to post your point about the vote to defund PP. Coulda been in any number of other threads, but you picked this one. This particular vote you highlighted revolves entirely around the fact that it has been revealed that there is illegal trafficking in human body parts, for profit, under the guise of 'research'. Since there will be no investigation by the DOJ for political reasons, Congress did what it is allowed to do. It failed to defund it this time. Had this most recent video I posted been available before the vote, I bet the result would have been different.
I doubt that you watched the video. But if you had, you would have seen a mass of body parts dumped out in a tray being poked around and discussed. I clearly saw a set of tiny lungs, an eye, a little arm with a reasonably developed hand as well as a leg of this particular aborted human being discussed like it was ingredients for a stir fry.
I stayed entirely on topic, while you spun in every other direction, ending up with fighter jets. PP, while having done some good in the beginning of its existence, despite being founded by a known eugenicist, has outlived its usefulness and twisted its mission to the point where it views pregnant women as breeders of human body parts for profit. Time for it to go, especially since the ACA has made it a redundant and unnecessary business.
All's I said earlier was just make trafficking in human body parts legal. Sure I said baby parts, but you knew what I meant, my nuanced one. I'm sick of the lying about it.
I'm pro choice, so there is none of the pro life part in my take. Let's just be honest and call it what it is. Its currently illegal. Let's just call it what it is and make it legal.
Just don't be a denier and say its not happening, cuz it is happening.
The only thing I pointed out was your blatantly dishonest use of the term 'baby', as extremists are wont to do. Not a peep about whether or not fetuses/embryos get donated to research (which is think both legal and ethically fine). Now profiting of chopped up babies, infants, or children without consent would strike me as illegal. But that doesn't seem relevant, just red meat, so to speak, to anger and take away funding so some people will end up having to resort to unsafe back alley abortions once again.
Oh, and since you're once again defending extremists, this time under the guise of 'spending' (do you have a F-35 for sale? I'll buy that off of you too):
PS: I do have to say taking all of the sting-y bait, and running with it, is a "brilliant" tactic if you're trying to alienate what is perhaps the biggest voting bloc, namely women.
I guess those semantics came into play after all!
Sadly, I just think that there are situations where it is better than the alternative and the choice should not be taken away.
