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kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: drifting
Gender: Male


Posted: May 2, 2019 - 6:40pm

kcar wrote:

 
You could whittle down each and every candidate into a shady puppet. You have ... when you  ... you're voting.....

if you don't have allies in Congress and the judicial branch, you're not going to get much done as president.
 
 
 
Such is the fate of Donald Trump ...

.
But back to Biden ...  He may not last long as it becomes the democrats turn to face scrutiny over what they did in the 2016 election.  Something that they have been able to avoid so far.
.
NYT ran a devastating piece on Biden's self-dealing in Ukraine. So why is the headline about Trump?

and the actual article in question ... readable as the NYT paywall is down until May 5th

Biden Faces Conflict of Interest Questions That Are Being Promoted by Trump and Allies

.
What goes around comes around ...


Isabeau

Isabeau Avatar

Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: May 2, 2019 - 4:40pm



 haresfur wrote:
Biden would make a great Vice President 
 


Isabeau

Isabeau Avatar

Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: May 2, 2019 - 4:15pm



 kcar wrote:

 
You could whittle down each and every candidate into a shady puppet. You have ... when you  ... you're voting.....

if you don't have allies in Congress and the judicial branch, you're not going to get much done as president.
 
I do agree with your concern about the broadness of Joe's appeal. Frankly, he could ramble on about baseball or riding the commuter train and it would be like the sweet air of heaven compared to the all-permeating fecal stench of Donald Trump's Tower of Babbled Lies, but I don't know if he sparks the hope of "Yes We Can" in the hearts of young voters.
 
If you're looking for The New Hope, maybe Beto appeals...if he ever gets his campaign underway. Like you I'll vote for the nominee but I think that as nice as Pete Buttigieg seems, going from mayor of South Bend to POTUS is a huge goddamned leap.
 
 
As for Biden and Anita Hill, there's an interesting op-ed about the matter:
 
 
 
Joe Biden doesn’t owe me an apology. Only Anita Hill can speak to what he owes her, but as “the uncalled witness” in the 1991 Senate confirmation hearings of Supreme Court nominee Clarence Thomas, I believe we have more pressing issues than whether Biden has sufficiently apologized for what did or did not happen almost three decades ago.
...
  Biden is not a #MeToo villain. 

 

I respectfully agree. We do not need to hang Anita Hills mistreatment solely on JB.

I'm merely pointing out the not-so-good-timing of his entry into the race ... soon after a repeat of the National Screw Women have endured for decades since A.H.  He's a great guy. and my choices aren't based on genitalia. However, many, many of us women who graduated college in the mid 80s, worked all these years and assumed the ol boys club around assault and extremely uncomfortable work environment were over, are finding, ever more grossly, four decades later, we have been proven wrong.
An apology from CH means zilch,  However, I may consider one from Shlitz Kavanaugh.

Many, many women are disgusted that rape kits still sit in Police evidence rooms without funding to test them. Long after the statute of limitations is out.  
Kristine came out despite moving and death threats to her family. Yet one political party decided a lust for power and tax cuts was more important than listening to her.
Now, a stacked SCOTUS may take our autonomy away - colluding with a wanna-be religious state.

I am NOT a raging feminist. I subscribe to the sense that no one race, gender or religious affiliation has a monopoly on assholes.

But ... Truly how many men here have sisters, daughters, wives, mothers, women in their lives they love are not troubled by this?
kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: May 1, 2019 - 8:04pm

 Isabeau wrote:
Biden is Wall Street and Corporations' choice, not ours. He is safe to them, he'll still look out for their interests. His immediate meeting and cash haul from Comcast says EVERYTHING we need to know about him.
Yet . . .
I'm behind whoever gets the nom. Just don't think ol Joe's past will pass muster with women and youth. The recent Kavanaugh Calendars and Confirmation spectacle brought back Anita Hill ...on steroids. Women are still fekked in 2018? A long ago sore spot has become a festered wound for many women now. Joe's part won't easily be forgotten or forgiven, unfortunately.

 
 
You could whittle down each and every candidate into a shady puppet. You have to look at the policies a candidate promotes and the likelihood s/he will get them enacted. Remember that when you vote for a presidential candidate, you're voting for his/her party as well. If the candidate can't or won't gain support from the party or compromise with the party, not much is going to get done. Personally, that's my main concern about a Bernie Sander's presidency: he has no record of legislative compromise IIRC and won't accept anything less than Medicare for All. It's also the reason I won't vote for a third-party candidate: if you don't have allies in Congress and the judicial branch, you're not going to get much done as president.
 
I do agree with your concern about the broadness of Joe's appeal. Frankly, he could ramble on about baseball or riding the commuter train and it would be like the sweet air of heaven compared to the all-permeating fecal stench of Donald Trump's Tower of Babbled Lies, but I don't know if he sparks the hope of "Yes We Can" in the hearts of young voters.
 
If you're looking for The New Hope, maybe Beto appeals...if he ever gets his campaign underway. Like you I'll vote for the nominee but I think that as nice as Pete Buttigieg seems, going from mayor of South Bend to POTUS is a huge goddamned leap.
 
 
As for Biden and Anita Hill, there's an interesting op-ed about the matter:
 
 
 

Joe Biden doesn’t owe me an apology. Only Anita Hill can speak to what he owes her, but as “the uncalled witness” in the 1991 Senate confirmation hearings of Supreme Court nominee Clarence Thomas, I believe we have more pressing issues than whether Biden has sufficiently apologized for what did or did not happen almost three decades ago.

Let’s get our priorities straight. We can discuss ad nauseam whether Biden acted appropriately during those 1991 hearings, and whether he’s too touchy-feely now. But why allow those issues to derail his presidential bid when the vulgar, always inappropriate current occupant of the White House has bragged about groping women and entering dressing rooms to ogle half-naked girls during the Miss Teen USA pageant? At stake is the 2020 presidential election, and if we don’t keep our eyes on that prize, we might find ourselves trumped again.

 
 
...
 
 

Biden is not a #MeToo villain. He wrote the Violence Against Women Act of 1994, which survives despite Republican attempts to cut funding and a Supreme Court decision gutting a key provision that allowed women the right to sue their attackers. That law was recently reauthorized by the House and awaits Senate consideration. The law was a measure of Biden’s character, and what he now proposes as a candidate should be judged just as carefully.

 

haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: May 1, 2019 - 6:12pm

Biden would make a great Vice President 
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: May 1, 2019 - 4:23pm

I don't like Joe much at all. However, if he is the nominee, I will vote for him.
westslope

westslope Avatar

Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: May 1, 2019 - 4:12pm



 R_P wrote:
In addition to Biden’s disturbing record on domestic policy, he has been a consistent warmonger. He has supported every military intervention he’s been able to, including, most disastrously voting for the 2002 resolution authorizing war against Iraq and ushering the country into the endless war against “terror” we remain immersed in.

 

I am reading and hearing a lot of mediocre and poor reasons to not politically support Biden but his track record on foreign military adventures is a good reason not to vote for Biden.

More fundamentally, are American voters ready to elect a President who will defy Israel as well as raise excise taxes on polluting fuels?   Probably not so folks should  simply brace yourself for more wealth-destroying military "training".     Is the US$5 Billion per year spent on maintaining the naval fleet close to the Strait of Hormuz money well spent to maintain the US addiction to polluting fossil fuels and cheap energy entitlement?  You tell me.   One estimate suggests that the USA has spent US$18 trillion protecting the Strait of Hormuz.  

Frankly if it were not for full on support for the Israeli nation building process, would the USA have invaded and occupied Iraq and Afghanistan and currently be at loggerheads with Hamas and Iran?  

Will any Democratic Party candidate have the courage to stand up and directly question the US War on Terror?   Probably not.  
Isabeau

Isabeau Avatar

Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: May 1, 2019 - 2:35pm

Biden is Wall Street and Corporations' choice, not ours. He is safe to them, he'll still look out for their interests. His immediate meeting and cash haul from Comcast says EVERYTHING we need to know about him.
Yet . . .
I'm behind whoever gets the nom. Just don't think ol Joe's past will pass muster with women and youth. The recent Kavanaugh Calendars and Confirmation spectacle brought back Anita Hill ...on steroids. Women are still fekked in 2018? A long ago sore spot has become a festered wound for many women now. Joe's part won't easily be forgotten or forgiven, unfortunately.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: May 1, 2019 - 1:57pm

In addition to Biden’s disturbing record on domestic policy, he has been a consistent warmonger. He has supported every military intervention he’s been able to, including, most disastrously voting for the 2002 resolution authorizing war against Iraq and ushering the country into the endless war against “terror” we remain immersed in.

sirdroseph

sirdroseph Avatar

Location: Yes
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 3, 2019 - 2:22am



 pigtail wrote:


 steeler wrote:


 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 sirdroseph wrote:
I am extremely emotional, touchy and huggy with my inner circle of family and friends and none of them will not know how I feel about them when I or they go. But I don't act that way to acquaintances and strangers and certainly not children acquaintances and strangers.

I'm not arguing the general premise, but politics is weird. If we elected people based on their skill set alone, this wouldn't be an issue. But a politician MUST appeal to more than a person's rational thought. "He seems like a guy I could have a beer with." They have just seconds to win a person over. Maybe we're entering a time when this touchy-feely tactic isn't going to be effective, but for certain politicians it's what got them where they are. In that light, this is less than zero as a sexual predation thing; it's more likely a political survival technique. Learned, mastered, worn out, and can be un-learned.
 

Yes, there is that. There also are other differences in play, some of them generational and some of them gender-based; some are just differences from individual to individual.  Let me say at the outset of this comment, that I certainly am not trying to minimize inappropriate  touching and certainly not anything that rises to the level of sexual assault. That said, there are differences in socialization.   For example, as a young man, I realized (or at least it appeared to me) that men tended more to shake hands as a greeting than hug in social settings whereas women tended more towards hugging.  Over time, that difference has decreased quite a bit .  At various times, I remember being unsure whether I should be greeting a female friend or acquaintance with a hug or a handshake.  It was sometimes awkward for me to figure that out at that precise moment, but not because I thought hugging would be inappropriate or offensive.   Another example: in my experience, it is not unusual for women in social or business settings to touch me on the arm while making a point, be it a humorous one or a more emphatic one.  Nothing romantic or offensive about it, at least in my mind. Men, on the other hand, were more prone to clap someone or touch someone on the shoulder.  A lot of this has changed, but some of it still exists.  I am probably not explaining this very well, but maybe the general gist of what I am trying to say is apparent.   

   
 

I dunno about anyone else but I don't want any politician being touchy/feely with me at all.  That is not the reason they are leaders.  Then again I am rarely star struck or impressed by so called celebrities either.  Someone that does their job well is enough for me.  As far as touching at work. Handshakes and hugs are too be distributed at the participants discretion.  If I worked for a huge firm or corporation, I would never hug anyone, male or female.  At a smaller business where the atmosphere is more family like, I have hugged both males and females at the appropriate times.  A little common sense goes a long way but as my boss always says......."Common sense is not evenly distributed."
 

I completely concur.  Speaking of common sense, I know the difference between an affectionate person and someone who likes to cop feels.  Joe happens to be both.  It can be subjective of course and I may not be the smartest man, Jennaay, but I was given a good heap of common sense.

pigtail

pigtail Avatar

Location: Southern California
Gender: Female


Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 3:38pm



 steeler wrote:


 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 sirdroseph wrote:
I am extremely emotional, touchy and huggy with my inner circle of family and friends and none of them will not know how I feel about them when I or they go. But I don't act that way to acquaintances and strangers and certainly not children acquaintances and strangers.

I'm not arguing the general premise, but politics is weird. If we elected people based on their skill set alone, this wouldn't be an issue. But a politician MUST appeal to more than a person's rational thought. "He seems like a guy I could have a beer with." They have just seconds to win a person over. Maybe we're entering a time when this touchy-feely tactic isn't going to be effective, but for certain politicians it's what got them where they are. In that light, this is less than zero as a sexual predation thing; it's more likely a political survival technique. Learned, mastered, worn out, and can be un-learned.
 

Yes, there is that. There also are other differences in play, some of them generational and some of them gender-based; some are just differences from individual to individual.  Let me say at the outset of this comment, that I certainly am not trying to minimize inappropriate  touching and certainly not anything that rises to the level of sexual assault. That said, there are differences in socialization.   For example, as a young man, I realized (or at least it appeared to me) that men tended more to shake hands as a greeting than hug in social settings whereas women tended more towards hugging.  Over time, that difference has decreased quite a bit .  At various times, I remember being unsure whether I should be greeting a female friend or acquaintance with a hug or a handshake.  It was sometimes awkward for me to figure that out at that precise moment, but not because I thought hugging would be inappropriate or offensive.   Another example: in my experience, it is not unusual for women in social or business settings to touch me on the arm while making a point, be it a humorous one or a more emphatic one.  Nothing romantic or offensive about it, at least in my mind. Men, on the other hand, were more prone to clap someone or touch someone on the shoulder.  A lot of this has changed, but some of it still exists.  I am probably not explaining this very well, but maybe the general gist of what I am trying to say is apparent.   

   
 

I dunno about anyone else but I don't want any politician being touchy/feely with me at all.  That is not the reason they are leaders.  Then again I am rarely star struck or impressed by so called celebrities either.  Someone that does their job well is enough for me.  As far as touching at work. Handshakes and hugs are too be distributed at the participants discretion.  If I worked for a huge firm or corporation, I would never hug anyone, male or female.  At a smaller business where the atmosphere is more family like, I have hugged both males and females at the appropriate times.  A little common sense goes a long way but as my boss always says......."Common sense is not evenly distributed."
steeler

steeler Avatar

Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth


Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 3:26pm



 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 sirdroseph wrote:
I am extremely emotional, touchy and huggy with my inner circle of family and friends and none of them will not know how I feel about them when I or they go. But I don't act that way to acquaintances and strangers and certainly not children acquaintances and strangers.

I'm not arguing the general premise, but politics is weird. If we elected people based on their skill set alone, this wouldn't be an issue. But a politician MUST appeal to more than a person's rational thought. "He seems like a guy I could have a beer with." They have just seconds to win a person over. Maybe we're entering a time when this touchy-feely tactic isn't going to be effective, but for certain politicians it's what got them where they are. In that light, this is less than zero as a sexual predation thing; it's more likely a political survival technique. Learned, mastered, worn out, and can be un-learned.
 

Yes, there is that. There also are other differences in play, some of them generational and some of them gender-based; some are just differences from individual to individual.  Let me say at the outset of this comment, that I certainly am not trying to minimize inappropriate  touching and certainly not anything that rises to the level of sexual assault. That said, there are differences in socialization.   For example, as a young man, I realized (or at least it appeared to me) that men tended more to shake hands as a greeting than hug in social settings whereas women tended more towards hugging.  Over time, that difference has decreased quite a bit .  At various times, I remember being unsure whether I should be greeting a female friend or acquaintance with a hug or a handshake.  It was sometimes awkward for me to figure that out at that precise moment, but not because I thought hugging would be inappropriate or offensive.  I was just more oriented toward shaking hands than hugging. Another example: in my experience, it is not unusual for women in social or business settings to touch me on the arm while making a point, be it a humorous one or a more emphatic one.  Nothing romantic or offensive about it, at least in my mind. Men, on the other hand, were more prone to clap someone or touch someone on the shoulder.  A lot of this has changed, but some of it still exists.  I am probably not explaining this very well, but maybe the general gist of what I am trying to say is apparent.   

   
kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 3:09pm

 miamizsun wrote:
 kcar wrote:
Let's just jerk take this full circle: 

funny scene  ;-)

metaphorically speaking, i find it a bit suspect that an opponent waits four years and when he comes up to bat calls him out on his juicing

of course media can be edited to make his (potentially) minor snarfing problem a flashing sign

i searched and saw him snuggling with men too

it also looks like he isn't shy about professing feelings/love for the people in his circle (the guy has loved and lost a lot)

==========

admittedly, as i have gotten older and lost quite a few people very close to me, i have started "completing" conversations
 

Yeah, I thought the same thing about that NV politician. IIRC she said she would vote for Biden over Trump, though...

Joe has been a demonstratively affectionate guy for a while, though. The hugs and back rubs aren't new. I posted this pic somewhere in this forum a while back, and nothing about it was staged or Photoshopped: 


Joe Biden with bikers, rubbing back of woman biker. Two biker men are NOT pleased.
WashPo rushes to reassure: 

No, a lady biker did not sit in Joe Biden’s lap Sunday

Some older folks, you worry that they're going to fall and break their hip. Joe? You worry that he's going to innocently going to make a fool of himself on a regular basis. 

Trump? You know he's sleazy enough to break every law if he thinks he can get away with it, and stupid enough to drag us all down with him when things go sideways. 

miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 10:38am

 oldviolin wrote:

Duh...

 


R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 10:20am

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:
 sirdroseph wrote:
I am extremely emotional, touchy and huggy with my inner circle of family and friends and none of them will not know how I feel about them when I or they go. But I don't act that way to acquaintances and strangers and certainly not children acquaintances and strangers.

I'm not arguing the general premise, but politics is weird. If we elected people based on their skill set alone, this wouldn't be an issue. But a politician MUST appeal to more than a person's rational thought. "He seems like a guy I could have a beer with." They have just seconds to win a person over. Maybe we're entering a time when this touchy-feely tactic isn't going to be effective, but for certain politicians it's what got them where they are. In that light, this is less than zero as a sexual predation thing; it's more likely a political survival technique. Learned, mastered, worn out, and can be un-learned.
 
Imagine kissing other people's babies/kids. Yuck!
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 10:16am

 oldviolin wrote:

Duh
 
ribbit
ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 9:35am



 sirdroseph wrote:
I am extremely emotional, touchy and huggy with my inner circle of family and friends and none of them will not know how I feel about them when I or they go. But I don't act that way to acquaintances and strangers and certainly not children acquaintances and strangers.

I'm not arguing the general premise, but politics is weird. If we elected people based on their skill set alone, this wouldn't be an issue. But a politician MUST appeal to more than a person's rational thought. "He seems like a guy I could have a beer with." They have just seconds to win a person over. Maybe we're entering a time when this touchy-feely tactic isn't going to be effective, but for certain politicians it's what got them where they are. In that light, this is less than zero as a sexual predation thing; it's more likely a political survival technique. Learned, mastered, worn out, and can be un-learned.
oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 9:24am

 miamizsun wrote:

admittedly, as i have gotten older and lost quite a few people very close to me, i have started "completing" conversations


 
Duh...
oldviolin

oldviolin Avatar

Location: esse quam videri
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 9:20am



 Red_Dragon wrote:
NoJoe.
 
Duh

sirdroseph

sirdroseph Avatar

Location: Yes
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 2, 2019 - 5:04am

 miamizsun wrote:
 kcar wrote:
Let's just jerk take this full circle: 

funny scene  ;-)

metaphorically speaking, i find it a bit suspect that an opponent waits four years and when he comes up to bat calls him out on his juicing

of course media can be edited to make his (potentially) minor snarfing problem a flashing sign

i searched and saw him snuggling with men too

it also looks like he isn't shy about professing feelings/love for the people in his circle (the guy has loved and lost a lot)

==========

admittedly, as i have gotten older and lost quite a few people very close to me, i have started "completing" conversations


 
I am extremely emotional, touchy and huggy with my inner circle of family and friends and none of them will not know how I feel about them when I or they go.  But I don't act that way to acquaintances and strangers and certainly not children acquaintances and strangers.{#Naughty}
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