[ ]   [ ]   [ ]                        [ ]      [ ]   [ ]

Baseball, anyone? - SeriousLee - Sep 21, 2019 - 2:43pm
 
Climate Change - R_P - Sep 21, 2019 - 2:39pm
 
What are you listening to now? - SeriousLee - Sep 21, 2019 - 12:07pm
 
Trump - R_P - Sep 21, 2019 - 10:46am
 
Today in History - Red_Dragon - Sep 21, 2019 - 10:33am
 
Best guitarists - Red_Dragon - Sep 21, 2019 - 10:29am
 
YouTube: Music-Videos - oldviolin - Sep 21, 2019 - 9:52am
 
Guns - steeler - Sep 21, 2019 - 9:37am
 
Things You Thought Today - Ohmsen - Sep 21, 2019 - 7:24am
 
Phillip K. DIck - Ohmsen - Sep 21, 2019 - 5:38am
 
What Do You Want From RP? - Ohmsen - Sep 21, 2019 - 4:26am
 
Radio Paradise Comments - Ohmsen - Sep 21, 2019 - 4:09am
 
Questions. - buzz - Sep 20, 2019 - 10:21pm
 
Pink Floyd Set? - kurtster - Sep 20, 2019 - 7:54pm
 
Name My Band - haresfur - Sep 20, 2019 - 7:48pm
 
Good Night and Good Luck - SeriousLee - Sep 20, 2019 - 5:22pm
 
260,000 Posts in one thread? - SeriousLee - Sep 20, 2019 - 5:21pm
 
What are you doing RIGHT NOW? - SeriousLee - Sep 20, 2019 - 5:19pm
 
Apple's iOS 13 now supports telling Siri to listen to Rad... - BillG - Sep 20, 2019 - 3:54pm
 
What Did You See Today? - KurtfromLaQuinta - Sep 20, 2019 - 2:02pm
 
volcano! - R_P - Sep 20, 2019 - 2:02pm
 
Marijuana: Baked News. - westslope - Sep 20, 2019 - 12:38pm
 
Solar / Wind / Geothermal / Efficiency Energy - aflanigan - Sep 20, 2019 - 10:59am
 
Holy Frack! - R_P - Sep 20, 2019 - 10:33am
 
Radio Paradise NFL Pick'em Group - SeriousLee - Sep 20, 2019 - 9:34am
 
Play the Blues - oldviolin - Sep 20, 2019 - 9:24am
 
HALF A WORLD - oldviolin - Sep 20, 2019 - 9:17am
 
Things I wish for ..... - oldviolin - Sep 20, 2019 - 8:17am
 
Live Music - R_P - Sep 19, 2019 - 7:56pm
 
The Global War on Terror - westslope - Sep 19, 2019 - 6:59pm
 
The House I Want (Today) - Isabeau - Sep 19, 2019 - 2:43pm
 
Bug Reports & Feature Requests - nickferrante10 - Sep 19, 2019 - 2:33pm
 
September 19th is International Talk Like A Pirate Day - oldviolin - Sep 19, 2019 - 1:15pm
 
Cryptic Posts - Leave Them Guessing - oldviolin - Sep 19, 2019 - 12:54pm
 
Health Care - black321 - Sep 19, 2019 - 12:48pm
 
Bob Dylan - R_P - Sep 19, 2019 - 12:02pm
 
Environment - R_P - Sep 19, 2019 - 11:39am
 
Positive Thoughts and Prayer Requests - miamizsun - Sep 19, 2019 - 11:32am
 
Pernicious Pious Proclivities Particularized Prodigiously - R_P - Sep 19, 2019 - 10:33am
 
E.O. Wilson: The Creation - oldviolin - Sep 19, 2019 - 8:59am
 
Canada - sirdroseph - Sep 19, 2019 - 8:50am
 
No RP on Amazon Echo in UK - Jim_Messenger - Sep 19, 2019 - 4:29am
 
RP App for Android - jarro - Sep 19, 2019 - 4:26am
 
Player in Firefox not stable - jarro - Sep 19, 2019 - 4:15am
 
Chair & Posture - haresfur - Sep 18, 2019 - 6:18pm
 
Room 3a - haresfur - Sep 18, 2019 - 6:15pm
 
Food Texture Issues - miamizsun - Sep 18, 2019 - 4:03pm
 
Cooking for Friends.... - oldviolin - Sep 18, 2019 - 12:03pm
 
Celebrity Face Recognition - oldviolin - Sep 18, 2019 - 11:39am
 
Nuclear power - saviour or scourge? - westslope - Sep 18, 2019 - 11:00am
 
Trump Lies - R_P - Sep 18, 2019 - 10:47am
 
Poetry Forum - oldviolin - Sep 18, 2019 - 10:04am
 
Mixtape Culture Club - miamizsun - Sep 18, 2019 - 6:59am
 
Brexit - Coaxial - Sep 18, 2019 - 5:55am
 
Counting with Pictures - yuel - Sep 18, 2019 - 12:53am
 
The Obituary Page - Red_Dragon - Sep 17, 2019 - 2:58pm
 
Strips, cartoons, illustrations - R_P - Sep 17, 2019 - 12:29pm
 
What makes you smile? - PoundPuppy - Sep 17, 2019 - 11:46am
 
Drones - R_P - Sep 17, 2019 - 11:23am
 
Democratic Party - westslope - Sep 17, 2019 - 11:02am
 
The Electoral College - westslope - Sep 17, 2019 - 10:50am
 
What the world needs now is .... - Proclivities - Sep 17, 2019 - 8:50am
 
Vinyl Only Spin List - kurtster - Sep 16, 2019 - 6:40pm
 
Australia has Disappeared - haresfur - Sep 16, 2019 - 3:28pm
 
What song is this... Yoshida Brothers ? - nf_able - Sep 16, 2019 - 1:32pm
 
2020 Elections - miamizsun - Sep 16, 2019 - 11:25am
 
Favorite Quotes - oldviolin - Sep 16, 2019 - 11:03am
 
Thoughts in the Middle of the Night - oldviolin - Sep 16, 2019 - 10:33am
 
Bear! - Proclivities - Sep 16, 2019 - 6:35am
 
9/11 - westslope - Sep 15, 2019 - 10:11pm
 
The Dragons' Roost - Isabeau - Sep 15, 2019 - 8:25pm
 
THE CARS featuring TODD RUNDGREN - kurtster - Sep 15, 2019 - 8:03pm
 
Immigration - R_P - Sep 15, 2019 - 4:00pm
 
Interesting or Weird Cover Versions - SeriousLee - Sep 15, 2019 - 10:52am
 
FLAC stream - amokbunny - Sep 15, 2019 - 4:21am
 
Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » Fix My Car Page: Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 144  Next
Post to this Topic
ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 2:43pm

 cc_rider wrote:

Agreed. And it sounds like something entirely different from what I usually think of when someone says 'warped rotor'. Riding the brake pedal down a long hill is a sure-fire way to melt a disc. As is heavy days at the track, but something tells me you're not running your GMC at Lime Rock. I've been wrong before though.

I think GM discs are not only too thin, but often too small in diameter as well. Again it's a weight issue, but in this case they erred too far the wrong way. Casual driving in non-hilly areas should not have significant effect on rotors: lasting only six months is a clear sign of a major design flaw.

The front discs on the ex's big Ford SEEM huge, but when the dang thing weighs 6,000#, they get a fair workout. I recently replaced both discs because they were WAY below minimum thickness: they didn't look too bad, but they were seriously worn down. If I was keeping it for myself I'd probably upgrade to larger/thicker/slotted/cryo'ed rotors.

If you're gonna keep the GMC, you might look into cryogenically treated rotors. They last a lot longer. On many vehicles you can also upgrade to thicker rotors, or thicker and vented rotors, or several other options. Worth trying if you're going through them that fast!

c.
 
My dad's Yukon... I drove it a few times and once in traffic in Denver I had to stand on the brakes.. the antilock kicked in and brought that thing to a stop really fast. Which is good. But it was still a $600 repair and I didn't hit anything! He's replaced them several (3?) times since that one. My 2WD Sierra has the same problem, tho, even tho I've been very cautious about hard stops (which is a bad thing too—you shouldn't be afraid to use the brakes!). Had them turned last summer and in a few months started to notice "something" and now it's definitely there. Wooomp woomp woomp.

I'll look into upgrading next time. It'd sure be worth it.

cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 2:37pm

 Lazy8 wrote:
I have. Turning rotors is kind of a racket; back in the day you could talk a mechanic into getting a few hundred thousand more miles out of a rotor by just knocking off the high spots, but nowadays everybody is so scared of getting sued they do it by the book or not at all.

When I replace my own pads I never turn the rotors at all. A few stops and the pads are grooved to match and work fine, but a brake shop that did that might wind up paying for a wreck because the brakes won't stop as well for the first few miles, and if an accident could conceivably theoretically or dishonestly be blamed on the brakes it will be.
  Absolutely on target. My mechanic buddy makes every possible effort to do things RIGHT, but sometimes somebody needs it done CHEAP. And sometimes he'll do it, sometimes not, depending on who it is and what the cheap fix is. But if there's any inkling he could get in a bind over it, he'll pass. I've seen him turn away business 'cause folks want something hinky.

Fear of litigation seems to drive a lot of business decisions.

c.


Lazy8

Lazy8 Avatar

Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 2:28pm

 Jimi_the_Saint wrote:
I've never had anyone tell me that they can't turn the rotors because of factory specs.  If someone told me that, I'd laugh and walk out the door.  Turning rotors is standard fare and saves some $$ between pad changes.  I would only turn them once, but I'll damn sure turn them that one time.
 
I have. Turning rotors is kind of a racket; back in the day you could talk a mechanic into getting a few hundred thousand more miles out of a rotor by just knocking off the high spots, but nowadays everybody is so scared of getting sued they do it by the book or not at all.

When I replace my own pads I never turn the rotors at all. A few stops and the pads are grooved to match and work fine, but a brake shop that did that might wind up paying for a wreck because the brakes won't stop as well for the first few miles, and if an accident could conceivably theoretically or dishonestly be blamed on the brakes it will be.

cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 2:15pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:
Wrong. A vehicle's brakes should not need a $500 repair after one moderately hard stop. It's a moneymaker pure and simple. Even without any hard stops, my GMC's brakes warp within about 6 months of casual driving. Compare to the Volvo, a heavy car which has been brought to a screeching halt several times: Just fine. GM rotors are too thin.
 
Agreed. And it sounds like something entirely different from what I usually think of when someone says 'warped rotor'. Riding the brake pedal down a long hill is a sure-fire way to melt a disc. As is heavy days at the track, but something tells me you're not running your GMC at Lime Rock. I've been wrong before though.

I think GM discs are not only too thin, but often too small in diameter as well. Again it's a weight issue, but in this case they erred too far the wrong way. Casual driving in non-hilly areas should not have significant effect on rotors: lasting only six months is a clear sign of a major design flaw.

The front discs on the ex's big Ford SEEM huge, but when the dang thing weighs 6,000#, they get a fair workout. I recently replaced both discs because they were WAY below minimum thickness: they didn't look too bad, but they were seriously worn down. If I was keeping it for myself I'd probably upgrade to larger/thicker/slotted/cryo'ed rotors.

If you're gonna keep the GMC, you might look into cryogenically treated rotors. They last a lot longer. On many vehicles you can also upgrade to thicker rotors, or thicker and vented rotors, or several other options. Worth trying if you're going through them that fast!

c.

Manbird

Manbird Avatar

Location: Oroville, Ca
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 2:05pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:

Wrong. A vehicle's brakes should not need a $500 repair after one moderately hard stop. It's a moneymaker pure and simple. Even without any hard stops, my GMC's brakes warp within about 6 months of casual driving. Compare to the Volvo, a heavy car which has been brought to a screeching halt several times: Just fine. GM rotors are too thin.
 


Merry Christmas!


ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 2:01pm

 cc_rider wrote:
*insert rant about driving style affecting rotor temps and warping here*

No snark intended. Driving in steep hills requires a whole different braking style. Learned it from my grandfather who lived in CO most of his life.

c.
 
Wrong. A vehicle's brakes should not need a $500 repair after one moderately hard stop. It's a moneymaker pure and simple. Even without any hard stops, my GMC's brakes warp within about 6 months of casual driving. Compare to the Volvo, a heavy car which has been brought to a screeching halt several times: Just fine. GM rotors are too thin.

cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:56pm

 rosedraws wrote:
Just learnt what a brake cylinder is.  That's what's broke on my car, not the drum (which is new).  (But we still think Honda is fleecing us by charging $250 to replace it... so... back to Midas.)
  Contact your local BBB and see what they say about independent mechanics in your area. You are almost guaranteed to get a better price, and maybe a better job of it too. $250 is mighty high to replace a wheel cylinder.

Brake systems have basically three 'cylinders': the master cylinder (which the pedal actually presses against), the slave cylinder (which is activated by the master), and the brake pistons/wheel cylinders. Each one is a piston inside a sleeve, with sliding seals to keep the fluid inside. A 'bad' cylinder just means the seals have gone out, so the fluid leaks out instead of activating the brakes.

Master cylinders do go bad: the most obvious sign is your floorboard is covered with oily liquid. Slave cylinders also go bad, but not as frequently. Brake pistons (on disc brakes) are pretty reliable, but wheel cylinders (on drum brakes) are often replaced as regular maintenance during a brake job.

Replacing a master or slave cylinder is a bit more involved than replacing a wheel cylinder: $250 would not be unreasonable for one of those, particularly if ABS is involved.

c.


cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:46pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:
*insert rant about warped rotors here*
  *insert rant about driving style affecting rotor temps and warping here*

No snark intended. Driving in steep hills requires a whole different braking style. Learned it from my grandfather who lived in CO most of his life.

c.


ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:44pm

 rosedraws wrote:
Just learnt what a brake cylinder is.  That's what's broke on my car, not the drum (which is new).  (But we still think Honda is fleecing us by charging $250 to replace it... so... back to Midas.)

 
Midas: are they all thieves or only the ones I've been to?

Pyro

Pyro Avatar



Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:42pm

 rosedraws wrote:
Just learnt what a brake cylinder is.  That's what's broke on my car, not the drum (which is new).  (But we still think Honda is fleecing us by charging $250 to replace it... so... back to Midas.)

 
Dealerships (IMHO) are almost ALWAYS a fleece....

rosedraws

rosedraws Avatar

Location: close to the edge
Gender: Female


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:42pm

Just learnt what a brake cylinder is.  That's what's broke on my car, not the drum (which is new).  (But we still think Honda is fleecing us by charging $250 to replace it... so... back to Midas.)
ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:40pm

 cc_rider wrote:
Yeah, but if a mechanic turns them below the 'allowable thickness', then the car won't pass inspection because of it (yep, they DO check), then the mechanic can be on the hook for repairing it properly. I agree, turning rotors is not a big deal as long as they're not too thin, but I think the margin is much less on newer cars: they are trying everything to meet EPA and CAFE standards. When you're under the gun to meet that kind of regs, it's an easy decision to shave a few thou off the rotor thickness...

c.
 
*insert rant about warped rotors here*

cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:37pm

 Jimi_the_Saint wrote:

I've never had anyone tell me that they can't turn the rotors because of factory specs.  If someone told me that, I'd laugh and walk out the door.  Turning rotors is standard fare and saves some $$ between pad changes.  I would only turn them once, but I'll damn sure turn them that one time.

  Yeah, but if a mechanic turns them below the 'allowable thickness', then the car won't pass inspection because of it (yep, they DO check), then the mechanic can be on the hook for repairing it properly. I agree, turning rotors is not a big deal as long as they're not too thin, but I think the margin is much less on newer cars: they are trying everything to meet EPA and CAFE standards. When you're under the gun to meet that kind of regs, it's an easy decision to shave a few thou off the rotor thickness...

c.


Jimi_the_Saint

Jimi_the_Saint Avatar

Location: Kan-tu-kee
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:30pm

 Southern_Boy wrote:

Easy answer - "Turning them will take them out of manufacturer's specifications. We can't do that. They must be replaced."

 
I've never had anyone tell me that they can't turn the rotors because of factory specs.  If someone told me that, I'd laugh and walk out the door.  Turning rotors is standard fare and saves some $$ between pad changes.  I would only turn them once, but I'll damn sure turn them that one time.
Manbird

Manbird Avatar

Location: Oroville, Ca
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:30pm

 BillJ wrote:


What about my snare drum? It is making a banging noise, how do I check that?
 
tap it with a stick, see what happens
cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:30pm

 BillJ wrote:
What about my snare drum? It is making a banging noise, how do I check that?
  Take it out of the trunk, silly. Sheesh, I gotta do EVERYTHING around here?

c.


BillJ

BillJ Avatar

Location: just far enough away from NYC
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:27pm

 cc_rider wrote:

Good point! I'm not sure WHICH car I'm talking about! It all applies though.
You may have front discs and rear drums (very common), or discs all around (becoming moreso), but the results are the same. Rear discs, like rear drums, see much less braking force, and wear more slowly than fronts. Which is why rear discs are usually smaller than the fronts (see weight savings comment).

If your wheels are 'open' enough to see/feel the brake discs, you can check them yourself. To check drum brakes you have to pull off the wheel and drum. Either way, I wouldn't take the mechanic's word for it: what's that old saying? "Trust, but Verify".

c.
 

What about my snare drum? It is making a banging noise, how do I check that?
cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:23pm

 p4jkafla wrote:
I'm confused cc_rider...

Are you talking about my car, or Rosedrawers' Honda?

Mine is front DISC brakes...and I was asking about pads on the FRONT of the car...(along with the rotor issue I mentioned...
 
Good point! I'm not sure WHICH car I'm talking about! It all applies though.
You may have front discs and rear drums (very common), or discs all around (becoming moreso), but the results are the same. Rear discs, like rear drums, see much less braking force, and wear more slowly than fronts. Which is why rear discs are usually smaller than the fronts (see weight savings comment).

If your wheels are 'open' enough to see/feel the brake discs, you can check them yourself. To check drum brakes you have to pull off the wheel and drum. Either way, I wouldn't take the mechanic's word for it: what's that old saying? "Trust, but Verify".

c.

rosedraws

rosedraws Avatar

Location: close to the edge
Gender: Female


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:16pm

maryte wrote:

I've had a Honda and an Acura - $600 for a timing belt is pretty standard (and I've *never* gone to a dealership). But more importantly, with that kind of milage on the beast, a timing belt is muy importante. If it goes, you can pretty much kiss the engine goodbye, so you *do* want to replace it before it breaks or you'll have a giant paperweight on your hands. Although I always remember what Click and Clack say: "There are three kinds of car problems: the ones that will strand you, the ones that will cost you, and the ones that will kill you.", and "First fix everything that makes the car stop, then fix everything that makes the car go." Those two statements are, of course, related.



Looks like we'll try to go back to the dealer for the timing belt, because the one good mechanic I know is pretty busy (duh). 

In December, the good mechanic will check out the Catalytic Converter ("might just be the Oxygen Sensor" all the car guys said).  I'll have him do the tuneup too because he can do it SO much cheaper than Honda.

None of the car guys I talked to could figure out how Honda got to $1600 for the Converter!

Total?  Closer to $1200 than $3000.  Whew!

p4jkafla

p4jkafla Avatar

Location: New England, USA
Gender: Female


Posted: Nov 7, 2008 - 1:16pm

 cc_rider wrote:
Oops.
That changes things: drums hardly EVER need replacing. Wheel cylinders, on the other hand, are often changed during brake jobs.

Rear drums and shoes can often last through two or three sets of rotors/pads: they just don't see the braking forces the front wheels do. That said, heavy trucks, used for hauling and such, can go through drums and discs like popcorn.

I'm skeptical of a mechanic saying you need new drums, particularly without seeing the car first. The guy COULD be legit, but it definitely raises a flag for me. Ditty is right on target: he'll have to pull the drums off to inspect them anyway, so have him show you the cracks, grooves, or whatever it is making him think they need replacing. My guess is he's fishing, and if you ask to see what the real problem is, he'll change his assessment.

c.
  I'm confused cc_rider...

Are you talking about my car, or Rosedrawers' Honda?

Mine is front DISC brakes...and I was asking about pads on the FRONT of the car...(along with the rotor issue I mentioned...


Page: Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 144  Next