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What Did You See Today? - kcar - Jun 13, 2021 - 7:32pm
 
Republican Party - Red_Dragon - Jun 13, 2021 - 5:31pm
 
Radio Paradise Comments - haresfur - Jun 13, 2021 - 5:18pm
 
Things You Thought Today - Steely_D - Jun 13, 2021 - 5:06pm
 
What Did You Do Today? - Antigone - Jun 13, 2021 - 3:21pm
 
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Military Matters - R_P - Jun 13, 2021 - 11:02am
 
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• • • Clownstock • • •  - Proclivities - Jun 13, 2021 - 6:17am
 
Vinyl Only Spin List - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jun 12, 2021 - 9:22pm
 
Great Old Songs You Rarely Hear Anymore - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jun 12, 2021 - 9:11pm
 
Last gas price paid? - KurtfromLaQuinta - Jun 12, 2021 - 9:06pm
 
COVID-19 - R_P - Jun 12, 2021 - 8:58pm
 
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punk? hip-hop? metal? noise? garage? - rhahl - Jun 12, 2021 - 4:15pm
 
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Lyrics that strike a chord today... - oldviolin - Jun 12, 2021 - 3:16pm
 
What is the meaning of this? - oldviolin - Jun 12, 2021 - 3:14pm
 
100 Things You Can Say To Irritate A Republican - Manbird - Jun 12, 2021 - 2:49pm
 
YouTube: Music-Videos - Steely_D - Jun 12, 2021 - 2:37pm
 
Pernicious Pious Proclivities Particularized Prodigiously - R_P - Jun 12, 2021 - 1:32pm
 
Trump Lies™ - R_P - Jun 12, 2021 - 12:21pm
 
Positive Thoughts and Prayer Requests - oldviolin - Jun 12, 2021 - 9:34am
 
Cryptic Posts - Leave Them Guessing - oldviolin - Jun 12, 2021 - 9:33am
 
• • • The Once-a-Day • • •  - oldviolin - Jun 12, 2021 - 9:24am
 
Talk Behind Their Backs Forum - oldviolin - Jun 12, 2021 - 8:48am
 
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Democratic Party - Red_Dragon - Jun 11, 2021 - 8:02pm
 
King Crimson - Steely_D - Jun 11, 2021 - 6:28pm
 
Race in America - R_P - Jun 11, 2021 - 5:21pm
 
What Makes You Laugh? - kcar - Jun 11, 2021 - 4:46pm
 
Gotta Get Your Drink On - oldviolin - Jun 11, 2021 - 4:02pm
 
Mixtape Culture Club - sirdroseph - Jun 11, 2021 - 2:38pm
 
Prog Rockers Anonymous - rgio - Jun 11, 2021 - 12:29pm
 
DQ (as in 'Daily Quote') - miamizsun - Jun 11, 2021 - 12:21pm
 
Automotive Lust - R_P - Jun 11, 2021 - 11:39am
 
Live Music - R_P - Jun 11, 2021 - 9:53am
 
Sweet horrible irony. - sirdroseph - Jun 11, 2021 - 5:35am
 
Those Lovable Policemen - sirdroseph - Jun 11, 2021 - 5:12am
 
Media Bias - sirdroseph - Jun 11, 2021 - 4:55am
 
Oh GOD, they're GAY! - sirdroseph - Jun 11, 2021 - 3:44am
 
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Covers! - oldviolin - Jun 9, 2021 - 5:39pm
 
If not RP, what are you listening to right now? - Steely_D - Jun 9, 2021 - 1:04pm
 
Beer - sirdroseph - Jun 9, 2021 - 12:59pm
 
Taxes, Taxes, Taxes (and Taxes) - R_P - Jun 9, 2021 - 11:50am
 
Play the Blues - rhahl - Jun 9, 2021 - 11:30am
 
Africa!! - Red_Dragon - Jun 9, 2021 - 6:17am
 
Is there any DOG news out there? - sirdroseph - Jun 9, 2021 - 5:57am
 
Mel Gibson, Anti-Semite - sirdroseph - Jun 9, 2021 - 5:12am
 
::odd but intriguing:: - Lazy8 - Jun 9, 2021 - 5:03am
 
LeftWingNutZ - sirdroseph - Jun 9, 2021 - 4:26am
 
Bitcoin - kurtster - Jun 8, 2021 - 7:14pm
 
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The Obituary Page - R_P - Jun 8, 2021 - 11:04am
 
Twelve Things That Suck - Your List - miamizsun - Jun 8, 2021 - 10:13am
 
Post your favorite 'You Tube' Videos Here - oldviolin - Jun 8, 2021 - 10:13am
 
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World Music - R_P - Jun 7, 2021 - 6:46pm
 
Trump - kcar - Jun 7, 2021 - 5:08pm
 
Bear! - Red_Dragon - Jun 7, 2021 - 4:23pm
 
volcano! - haresfur - Jun 7, 2021 - 4:16pm
 
Things that piss me off - oldviolin - Jun 7, 2021 - 4:01pm
 
Index » Regional/Local » USA/Canada » Republican Party Page: 1, 2, 3 ... 213, 214, 215  Next
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Red_Dragon

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Posted: Jun 13, 2021 - 5:31pm

R_P

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Posted: Jun 9, 2021 - 12:10pm

How Far Are Republicans Willing to Go? They’re Already Gone.
Determined to enforce white political dominance in pivotal states like Georgia, Arizona, Texas and North Carolina, Republicans are enacting or trying to enact laws restricting the right to vote, empowering legislatures to reject election outcomes and adopting election rules and procedures designed to block the emergence of multiracial political majorities. (...)

The precipitating event driving the current surge of regressive voting legislation in Republican-controlled states is Donald Trump’s defeat in 2020 and the widespread acceptance on the right of Trump’s subsequent claim that the presidency was stolen from him. The belief among Republicans that Trump is essential to their drive to slow or halt the growing power of nonwhite voters aligned with the Democratic Party has powered the broad acquiescence to that lie both by people who know better and by people who don’t. (...)

A longstanding finding in political science is that it is elites who preserve democracy, and elites who destroy democracy. Overwhelming majorities of voters support democracy in the abstract, but if they are told by elites that “the other party is trying to destroy democracy and these emergency measures are needed to preserve democracy by keeping the other side out of power,” most partisan voters are going to follow their leaders and support anti-democratic changes. This is especially the case in a highly polarized binary political system in which the thought of the opposing party taking power seems especially odious and even existential. (...)

These Republican-controlled state governments have become, in the words of Jacob Grumbach, a political scientist at the University of Washington, “Laboratories of Democratic Backsliding,” the title of his April paper.

Grumbach developed 61 indicators of the level of adherence to democratic procedures and practices — what he calls a “State Democracy Index” — and tracked those measures in the states over the period from 2000 to 2018. The indicators include registration and absentee voting requirements, restrictions on voter registration drives and gerrymandering practices.

Grumbach’s conclusion: “Republican control of state government, however, consistently and profoundly reduces state democratic performance during this time period.” (...)

From 2020 to 2036, the authors project that the percentage of eligible voters who identify as nonwhite in Texas will grow from 50 to 60 percent, in Georgia from 43 to 50 percent, in Arizona from 38 to 48 percent.

As these percentages grow, Republicans will be under constant pressure to enact state legislation to further restrict registration and voting. The question will become: How far are they willing to go?

I posed that question to Terry Moe, a political scientist at Stanford. His reply:
As for whether this electoral manipulation will “devolve into a broader rejection of the rule of law,” I would say that the Republican Party has already crossed the Rubicon. For four years during the Trump presidency, they defended or ignored his blatant abuses of power, his violations of democratic norms, and his attacks on our democratic institutions, and they routinely circled the wagons to protect him. They had countless opportunities to stand up for the Constitution and the rule of law, and they consistently failed to do so.

kcar

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Posted: Jun 4, 2021 - 7:43pm

 westslope wrote:

Let me clarify.  I actually wrote:  "Did the US help kick out the Russian soldiers from Afghanistan so Osama Bin Laden could bomb New York City and then Americans could celebrate an orgy of terrorist killings?"

The USA funnelled weapons and money through Osama bin Laden to the Mujahideen forces fighting Soviet troops in Afghanistan in late 1970s and early 1980s.  

The smart, cost-effective strategy would have been to let the Soviets do their thing in Afghanistan.  Afghanis would have eventually worn them down just like they have worn down every other invader and occupier.    It is unlikely that the Soviets would have had more success 'civilizing' the Afghanis than the Americans have had during the never-ending occupation.  

Although the Afghan theatre did demoralize and wear down the Soviets, it was the domestic rot that finally took the empire down.  In other words, the Americans got lucky.   



The USA did NOT funnel weapons and money through ObL to mujahideen in Afghanistan:  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

Under CIA's Operation Cyclone from 1979 to 1989, the United States and Saudi Arabia provided $40 billion worth of financial aid and weapons to almost 100,000 Mujahideen and Afghan Arabs from forty Muslim countries through Pakistan's ISI.<98> British journalist Jason Burke wrote that "He did not receive any direct funding or training from the US during the 1980s. Nor did his followers. The Afghan mujahideen, via Pakistan's ISI intelligence agency, received large amounts of both. Some bled to the Arabs fighting the Soviets but nothing significant."<99> Bin Laden met and built relations with Hamid Gul, who was a three-star general in the Pakistani army and head of the ISI agency. Although the United States provided the money and weapons, the training of militant groups was entirely done by the Pakistani Armed Forces and the ISI.<100> According to some CIA officers, beginning in early 1980, bin Laden acted as a liaison between the Saudi General Intelligence Presidency (GIP) and Afghan warlords, but no evidence of contact between the CIA and Bin Laden exists in the CIA archives.


"The smart, cost-effective strategy would have been to let the Soviets do their thing in Afghanistan."


Hindsight is 20/20. It's easy to play armchair quarterback to military action taking place 40+  years ago. There was no guarantee that the Soviets would have tired of occupying Afghanistan or changed their strategy in the region to relinquish Afghanistan. The US did make the mistake of ignoring Afghanistan after the USSR left but as I think we can both agree, even a non-military American presence in that country might not have prevented it from becoming a safe haven for ObL.  
westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: Jun 4, 2021 - 3:58pm

 kcar wrote:


I have no idea what you're talking about in the third paragraph. No, the US did not kick the Soviets out of Afghanistan.  .....

Let me clarify.  I actually wrote:  "Did the US help kick out the Russian soldiers from Afghanistan so Osama Bin Laden could bomb New York City and then Americans could celebrate an orgy of terrorist killings?"

The USA funnelled weapons and money through Osama bin Laden to the Mujahideen forces fighting Soviet troops in Afghanistan in late 1970s and early 1980s.  

The smart, cost-effective strategy would have been to let the Soviets do their thing in Afghanistan.  Afghanis would have eventually worn them down just like they have worn down every other invader and occupier.    It is unlikely that the Soviets would have had more success 'civilizing' the Afghanis than the Americans have had during the never-ending occupation.  

Although the Afghan theatre did demoralize and wear down the Soviets, it was the domestic rot that finally took the empire down.  In other words, the Americans got lucky.   

Red_Dragon

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Posted: Jun 1, 2021 - 7:13pm

Did RNC Video Depict Rioting in ‘Biden’s America’ Using Barcelona Footage?
cc_rider

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Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: May 25, 2021 - 7:16am

 Isabeau wrote:

Meanwhile, Greg Abbott of Texas has:
50,000+ Covid Deaths
187 unreliable Electric Grid Deaths
refuses Medicaid expansion
but claims to be 'pro-life.'
Passes bills allowing drive-thru cocktail/beer sales and
Unlicensed Gun carrying.
Insists on keeping $5 BILLION in Federal covid funds meant to keep Teachers and Students safe.
...While passing a Fetal heartbeat/anti-abortion bill at six weeks into pregnancy.
There is Nothing FETAL about a six week pregnancy. Its embryonic until the 3rd month. 

Now the Big Lie extends to allowing 'poll watchers' take photos of voters if 'suspected of possible voter fraud.

Without the filibuster,  this Tyranny will be in stone in Texas.
Matt Dillon wanna-be's with tiny peckers are in charge. 

Feel free to make "Split Hair, Word Salad" with that.

I never thought I would want Rick Perry back. 

Abbot, Patrick, and Paxton are state and national embarrassments. They are the poster children for everything immoral, unethical, un-Christian, and jingoistic about the GOP. Craven power-mongers.
c.




Isabeau

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Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: May 24, 2021 - 5:05pm

Meanwhile, Greg Abbott of Texas has:
50,000+ Covid Deaths
187 unreliable Electric Grid Deaths
refuses Medicaid expansion
but claims to be 'pro-life.'
Passes bills allowing drive-thru cocktail/beer sales and
Unlicensed Gun carrying.
Insists on keeping $5 BILLION in Federal covid funds meant to keep Teachers and Students safe.
...While passing a Fetal heartbeat/anti-abortion bill at six weeks into pregnancy.
There is Nothing FETAL about a six week pregnancy. Its embryonic until the 3rd month. 

Now the Big Lie extends to allowing 'poll watchers' take photos of voters if 'suspected of possible voter fraud.

Without the filibuster,  this Tyranny will be in stone in Texas.
Matt Dillon wanna-be's with tiny peckers are in charge. 

Feel free to make "Split Hair, Word Salad" with that.




cc_rider

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Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: May 24, 2021 - 3:49pm

 rgio wrote:

The history of a 2 party system is for each party to find and promote a candidate who can win their respective elections. It's produced a lot of very similar candidates over the years and eventually leads to the notion that abortion, guns, and deficits were the way to measure alignment with your political preferences.

Enter Trump, who has twisted the notion of alignment to be binary...Trump or never Trumpers.  In a world where tribal outguns logic, Trump can pull more people to his side than rational Republicans (see Liz Chaney).   Republicans now see that to get through a primary, they have to embrace the person...platforms don't matter.   When Trump candidates get to the general election, they generally lose, unless the state is so Red that any Republican candidate will win.   It's a recipe for disaster.  You can't count on crazy to carry the day.

So what do you do if you've been in politics for a while?  You have to get through the primary, so you embrace the crazy and avoid being called names by Trump.  When you get to the general election, you then have to walk a fine line between pissing of the Right while not allowing the Democrat running against you to prove you're nuts.  Those with some history might get through (see Cruz, Rubio, Jordan...), but those with no history will likely go down as insane.

Trump is going to kill Republican politics for a decade or two. It might take another election or two, but eventually, he's going to drag them all down with him....dead or alive.



But crazy has been carrying the day for some time now. Decades. Supply-side economics is just one example: the concept is fundamentally flawed - even one of it's original creators admits it. But crazy keeps cutting taxes, in good times and bad, clinging to a thoroughly-disproved - and time-testedly so - economic theory. Oddly, the results never change: rich get richer, poor get poorer. By the way, that is not a 'bug' of supply-side, it is a 'feature'.

I don't recall the exact quote or the quotee, but it's something like "nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people"

I am reading Charles P. Pierce's 'Idiot America', and while it's a bit dated now, he still lays out quite clearly that crazy has carried the day for quite a while...
c.



rgio

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Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: May 24, 2021 - 9:07am

 cc_rider wrote:
So, here's my question. If the powers-that-be in the GOP think climbing up Trump's behind is the 'Future of The Republican Party', what happens when, God forbid, the man dies? Sure his health is legendary, mythic even, but if he lives another, say fifteen years, what then? That's assuming he's the picture of health until the moment he strokes out. More likely, his compos mentis becomes increasingly 'non'. Do his followers, the base, go with him? Does the GOP power structure go along as well? Do the Q wackos concoct another scenario where he's actually an alien sent to save us all, with a lifespan far exceeding normal man? Or does the GOP start, as do the High Lamas, searching for and grooming his successor? Imagine a kid groomed from adolescence to be utterly amoral, venal, without scruples of any kind: legal, ethical, political or otherwise. Oh wait...

c.




The history of a 2 party system is for each party to find and promote a candidate who can win their respective elections. It's produced a lot of very similar candidates over the years and eventually leads to the notion that abortion, guns, and deficits were the way to measure alignment with your political preferences.

Enter Trump, who has twisted the notion of alignment to be binary...Trump or never Trumpers.  In a world where tribal outguns logic, Trump can pull more people to his side than rational Republicans (see Liz Chaney).   Republicans now see that to get through a primary, they have to embrace the person...platforms don't matter.   When Trump candidates get to the general election, they generally lose, unless the state is so Red that any Republican candidate will win.   It's a recipe for disaster.  You can't count on crazy to carry the day.

So what do you do if you've been in politics for a while?  You have to get through the primary, so you embrace the crazy and avoid being called names by Trump.  When you get to the general election, you then have to walk a fine line between pissing of the Right while not allowing the Democrat running against you to prove you're nuts.  Those with some history might get through (see Cruz, Rubio, Jordan...), but those with no history will likely go down as insane.

Trump is going to kill Republican politics for a decade or two. It might take another election or two, but eventually, he's going to drag them all down with him....dead or alive.


cc_rider

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Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: May 24, 2021 - 7:53am

 haresfur wrote:

That's pretty funny, since the right wing has used ballot initiatives in Democrat-controlled states for things like limiting taxes. It sounds to me like the Republicans are going all-in on setting up a one party system.

So, here's my question. If the powers-that-be in the GOP think climbing up Trump's behind is the 'Future of The Republican Party', what happens when, God forbid, the man dies? Sure his health is legendary, mythic even, but if he lives another, say fifteen years, what then? That's assuming he's the picture of health until the moment he strokes out. More likely, his compos mentis becomes increasingly 'non'. Do his followers, the base, go with him? Does the GOP power structure go along as well? Do the Q wackos concoct another scenario where he's actually an alien sent to save us all, with a lifespan far exceeding normal man? Or does the GOP start, as do the High Lamas, searching for and grooming his successor? Imagine a kid groomed from adolescence to be utterly amoral, venal, without scruples of any kind: legal, ethical, political or otherwise. Oh wait...

c.



haresfur

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Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: May 23, 2021 - 6:03pm

 R_P wrote:
Republicans Move to Limit a Grass-Roots Tradition of Direct Democracy
Through ballot initiatives, voters in red states have defied legislators’ wishes and produced liberal outcomes in recent years. Republicans want to make the practice harder, or even eliminate it.
So far in 2021, Republicans have introduced 144 bills to restrict the ballot initiative processes in 32 states, according to the Ballot Initiative Strategy Center, a liberal group that tracks and assists citizen-driven referendums. Of those bills, 19 have been signed into law by nine Republican governors. In three states, Republican lawmakers have asked voters to approve ballot initiatives that in fact limit their own right to bring and pass future ballot initiatives.


That's pretty funny, since the right wing has used ballot initiatives in Democrat-controlled states for things like limiting taxes. It sounds to me like the Republicans are going all-in on setting up a one party system.

R_P

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Posted: May 22, 2021 - 3:28pm

Republicans Move to Limit a Grass-Roots Tradition of Direct Democracy
Through ballot initiatives, voters in red states have defied legislators’ wishes and produced liberal outcomes in recent years. Republicans want to make the practice harder, or even eliminate it.
So far in 2021, Republicans have introduced 144 bills to restrict the ballot initiative processes in 32 states, according to the Ballot Initiative Strategy Center, a liberal group that tracks and assists citizen-driven referendums. Of those bills, 19 have been signed into law by nine Republican governors. In three states, Republican lawmakers have asked voters to approve ballot initiatives that in fact limit their own right to bring and pass future ballot initiatives.

R_P

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Posted: May 18, 2021 - 10:45am

Dark Money Group Brags About Writing GOP Voter Suppression Bills Across the Country
“We did it quickly and we did it quietly,” said the executive director of Heritage Action.

kcar

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Posted: May 17, 2021 - 5:39pm

 westslope wrote:

Remind us again.   How much in the way of bounties did the Russians pay Taliban fighters to kill Americans?   

Lying is apparently a bi-partisan passion.   American as Apple Pie.


Another reminder?  Did the US help kick out the Russian soldiers from Afghanistan so Osama Bin Laden could bomb New York City and then Americans could celebrate an orgy of terrorist killings?  

Did I get that right?  




I have no idea what you're talking about in the third paragraph. No, the US did not kick the Soviets out of Afghanistan. Jimmy Carter might have been re-elected if anything remotely like that occurred.

I never did follow the story claiming the Russians paid bounties to the Taliban to kill US soldiers. But to shrug off Trump's 30,000 lies during his presidency as "American as apple pie" is (with all due respect) utter lunacy.

I don't see how any reasonable and informed American can regard Trump's presidency as anything but a disaster. The GOP still can't come to grips with reality. It's still dancing to Trump's tune. You know you're in Bizarro World when Liz Cheney is the party's moral standard just because she doesn't think the election was rigged.
westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: May 17, 2021 - 5:18pm

Remind us again.   How much in the way of bounties did the Russians pay Taliban fighters to kill Americans?   

Lying is apparently a bi-partisan passion.   American as Apple Pie.


Another reminder?  Did the US help kick out the Russian soldiers from Afghanistan so Osama Bin Laden could bomb New York City and then Americans could celebrate an orgy of terrorist killings?  

Did I get that right?  


kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: May 17, 2021 - 5:11pm

 kurtster wrote:


Really ?  Not only are you dictating who can say what around here, you are also using whataboutism to justify it.

This is the Republican Party thread, right ?  HB is of interest to repubs and an embarrassment to you.

My advice to you would be to take a chill pill and stay out of this thread since it seems to bother you so much that you have to tell people what is okay to discuss in here.


Who here besides you cares about Hunter Biden? His business dealings and behavior were investigated and reported on before Joe officially announced that he was running for president.

Hunter is no embarrassment to me or the Democratic party. He had a rough childhood. He didn't handle it well as an adult. Apparently he's growing up.

You might as well be complaining about Roger Clinton. Hunter wasn't and isn't relevant to the Dems or the GOP.

If you want to talk about embarrassments and the GOP, let's talk about Trump and his deadly incompetence. You sure are awfully quiet about all those people who died of Covid because of Trump's lies—a number of epidemiologists have estimated it was around 400k. 

And hey, what about the insurrection that Trump whipped up at the Capitol building? Would you like to talk about that and the GOP's delusional insistence that the election was rigged?

westslope

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Location: BC sage brush steppe


Posted: May 17, 2021 - 4:59pm

So would somebody kindly tell us/remind us why the Russians 'invaded' the Crimea again?     What was the reason for the Russian-speaking citizens of the Ukraine to take up arms?

Was it worth the sanctions against Russia?    Billions of dollars of Exxon Mobil investment dried up.    What for?    




R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: May 17, 2021 - 4:15pm

 haresfur wrote:
You are saying the problem is that a story that has been spun into a "scandal" with no basis should have been spread more widely so some people would have believed it and changed their vote. So basically, the problem is that the fake-news didn't gain enough traction? Nah, that wouldn't matter, and I see no reason why Hunter Biden's business  reflects on Joe. On the other hand we have plenty of evidence that Rudy was trying to manipulate the story and spread a false narrative to hurt Biden. Would it matter to you if this was true?

Bannon/Giuliani's fake news October surprise didn't pan out (like the last time) and now some people haz a sad. Perhaps try winning with an actual platform that has merit.
haresfur

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Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: May 17, 2021 - 3:59pm

 kurtster wrote:


I saw the 8% number quite a few times, but that was a while ago.  I went with the lowest number that I had seen / heard.

Here try this one ...

Media's hiding of Hunter Biden scandal robbed Trump of clear win: Poll

Would it matter to you if this was true ? 


You are saying the problem is that a story that has been spun into a "scandal" with no basis should have been spread more widely so some people would have believed it and changed their vote. So basically, the problem is that the fake-news didn't gain enough traction? Nah, that wouldn't matter, and I see no reason why Hunter Biden's business  reflects on Joe. On the other hand we have plenty of evidence that Rudy was trying to manipulate the story and spread a false narrative to hurt Biden. Would it matter to you if this was true?
kurtster

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Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: May 17, 2021 - 3:41pm

 kcar wrote:

Really, it's time to STFU about Hunter Biden. Ivanka and Jared's graft and conflicts of interest make him look insignificant. 


Really ?  Not only are you dictating who can say what around here, you are also using whataboutism to justify it.

This is the Republican Party thread, right ?  HB is of interest to repubs and an embarrassment to you.

My advice to you would be to take a chill pill and stay out of this thread since it seems to bother you so much that you have to tell people what is okay to discuss in here.

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